Mint 22 - No Sound

[pinnerite]

It looks like the snd_hda_intel driver is not present on my machine and
So far I cannot find a way of installing it.

Should I try a different distro?

--
Linux Mint 22. kernel version 6.8.0-49-generic Cinnamon 6.4.1

[Jeff Layman]

On 08/12/2024 19:59, pinnerite wrote:
> It looks like the snd_hda_intel driver is not present on my machine and
> So far I cannot find a way of installing it.

<https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?p=2558875&hilit=snd_hda_intel#p2558875>

>
> Should I try a different distro?
>

--
Jeff

[Bobbie Sellers]

On 12/8/24 11:59, pinnerite wrote:
> It looks like the snd_hda_intel driver is not present on my machine and
> So far I cannot find a way of installing it.
>
> Should I try a different distro?
>

Well I prefer PCLinuxOS and it has the tools that
could be used to correct your problem, i.e. a cool gui
package manager and some repositories. In addition we have
the PCLinux Forum where Linux ninnies like me mingle with
packagers and coders to solve problems. Free registration
but will come with not frequent reminders to support
PCLinuxOS however you can. BBS-like fun here.
<https://www.pclinuxos.com/forum/index.php>
On that page behind a button saying MAIN is the site where
you can download or Torrent an ISO of your choice.
We have KDE Plasma 5 now and Plasma 6 when it is ready for
our users, Mate, XFCE in the main line. And then we have
a bunch of other stuff with Trinity and various other
Desktop environments. We even have a Debian version
without systemd, a significant attack interface.

So Pinneritce thank you for the opportunity to
get my PCLinusOS licks in. Now come and try it out.

Bliss -the hobbler

bliss- Dell Precision 7730-PCLOS 2024.12L-inux 6.6.63-Plasma 5.27.11

[Mike Easter]

Bobbie Sellers wrote:
> So Pinneritce thank you for the opportunity to get my PCLinusOS licks
> in. Now come and try it out.

I agree w/ checking out a wide variety of distro/s and DE/WMs and I also
agree that PCLOS is a fine one. It may not be as high on the DW page
hit list as others, but it is a very worthwhile project. Their DW
description supports the idea of media support:

> PCLinuxOS is a user-friendly Linux distribution with out-of-the-box
> support for many popular graphics and sound cards, as well as other
> peripheral devices.

Unlike most other distro/s which are based on an upstream parent and its
repo/s, PCLOS is 'independent, also a rolling release. Historically,
its 'father' dev, Bill Texstar Reynolds 'came from' Mandriva/Mandrake
influence, but he forked from that over 20 y ago. It is also 'different'
in that the distro is based on rpm packaging but likes the apt
management tools like for deb.

Another fun thing about PCLOS is the variety of the DE situation, as
there are community releases for others besides the main KDE/XFCE/Mate;
unfortunately there isn't a 'convenient' single link for those choices,
but there are LXQt & LXDE, Trinity (incl both mini & BigDaddy), and
OpenBox that I know of. That makes for lean PCLOS if one is inclined.

--
Mike Easter

[David]

On 08/12/2024 22:05, Mike Easter wrote:
> Bobbie Sellers wrote:
>> So Pinneritce thank you for the opportunity to get my PCLinusOS licks
>> in. Now come and try it out.
>
> I agree w/ checking out a wide variety of distro/s and DE/WMs and I also
> agree that PCLOS is a fine one.  It may not be as high on the DW page
> hit list as others, but it is a very worthwhile project.  Their DW
> description supports the idea of media support:
>
>> PCLinuxOS is a user-friendly Linux distribution with out-of-the-box
>> support for many popular graphics and sound cards, as well as other
>> peripheral devices.
>
> Unlike most other distro/s which are based on an upstream parent and its
> repo/s, PCLOS is 'independent, also a rolling release.  Historically,
> its 'father' dev, Bill Texstar Reynolds 'came from' Mandriva/Mandrake
> influence, but he forked from that over 20 y ago. It is also 'different'
> in that the distro is based on rpm packaging but likes the apt
> management tools like for deb.
>
> Another fun thing about PCLOS is the variety of the DE situation, as
> there are community releases for others besides the main KDE/XFCE/Mate;
> unfortunately there isn't a 'convenient' single link for those choices,
> but there are LXQt & LXDE, Trinity (incl both mini & BigDaddy), and
> OpenBox that I know of.  That makes for lean PCLOS if one is inclined.


I'm downloading PCLOS xfce right now. I'll use balenaEtcher to load the
software onto a memory stick. How do I make it operate 'live' on my Dell
laptop with the sound problem?

--
David

[Bobbie Sellers]

On 12/29/24 14:28, David wrote:
> On 08/12/2024 22:05, Mike Easter wrote:
>> Bobbie Sellers wrote:
>>> So Pinneritce thank you for the opportunity to get my PCLinusOS licks
>>> in. Now come and try it out.
>>
>> I agree w/ checking out a wide variety of distro/s and DE/WMs and I also
>> agree that PCLOS is a fine one.  It may not be as high on the DW page
>> hit list as others, but it is a very worthwhile project.  Their DW
>> description supports the idea of media support:
>>
>>> PCLinuxOS is a user-friendly Linux distribution with out-of-the-box
>>> support for many popular graphics and sound cards, as well as other
>>> peripheral devices.
>>
>> Unlike most other distro/s which are based on an upstream parent and
>> its repo/s, PCLOS is 'independent, also a rolling release.
>> Historically, its 'father' dev, Bill Texstar Reynolds 'came from'
>> Mandriva/Mandrake influence, but he forked from that over 20 y ago. It
>> is also 'different' in that the distro is based on rpm packaging but
>> likes the apt management tools like for deb.
>>
>> Another fun thing about PCLOS is the variety of the DE situation, as
>> there are community releases for others besides the main KDE/XFCE/
>> Mate; unfortunately there isn't a 'convenient' single link for those
>> choices, but there are LXQt & LXDE, Trinity (incl both mini &
>> BigDaddy), and OpenBox that I know of.  That makes for lean PCLOS if
>> one is inclined.
>
>
> I'm downloading PCLOS xfce right now. I'll use balenaEtcher to load the
> software onto a memory stick. How do I make it operate 'live' on my Dell
> laptop with the sound problem?
>
Well first you turn off the Secure Boot in the BIOS.
Then when booting your Dell and the Circle logo shows
up, hit F12 to go into the Boot Menu. Chose your boot media
there and it should boot right up.
If you have problems with PCLinuxOS you can bring them
up in the PCLinuxOS Forum at:<https://www.pclinuxos.com/forum/index.php>

You may have to register to write your question(s) but you
will have access to all the categories in Home which you will
see on the page.

Good luck to you and others trying out new distros in
the New Year.

bliss- Dell Precision 7730- PCLOS 2024.12- Linux 6.6.67- Plasma 5.27.11

[Paul]

On Sun, 12/29/2024 5:28 PM, David wrote:

> I'm downloading PCLOS xfce right now. I'll use balenaEtcher to load the
> software onto a memory stick. How do I make it operate 'live' on my Dell
> laptop with the sound problem?

Doing this much, was the hard part.

Why wouldn't it work ?

*******

You need to know how to do popup boot or how to do boot selection.
It's not nearly as easy on a Dell.

My Dell is rather unique in the room, in that if you plug in two
USB boot sticks, there is no way to select one of two. To have
my Dell boot a USB stick, there can only be one USB stick plugged in.
All the other computers in the room, you just cursor down to the
USB stick you want, out of N sticks.

The Dell has a quirky BIOS, which means there are a number of tiny issues.

*******

This means that, plugging the stick into some other brand of computer,
the experience could be a lot more pleasant. I find I have to spend
a lot more time with Dell people, using my fevered imagination to
guess at what curve ball Dell has thrown this time. Like various
beverages, Dell is an acquired taste. Some people get used to the
Dell abuse (unnecessary edits to the BIOS that Dell has you make),
other just leave their Dell parked in the corner.

I took my Dell out of RAID Ready mode, because it was driving me nuts.
What i didn't think about though, is if the BIOS CMOS battery
dies on me, I have no records of what settings have to be put back :-)
If the CMOS battery is changed, I'm going to have to do part of whatever
I did, over again.

Bring back a symptoms description, if it doesn't work. some of the Dell
sound, is standard stuff, but they also have a tiny amplifier board
and a piezo in mine, and sound has only come out of that a couple times.

You can use the

inxi -F

command and get a dump of what hardware is in the box. That is
easier than some other ways of listing the hardware.

On some of my hardware here, the sound is put on the HDMI cable, and
since none of my display devices have speakers, I would never hear a sound
sent there by accident. You have to review the output selection,
to ensure a real speaker is going to get the sound. I have to change
something from "HDMI sound" to "Analog speaker sound". Even Windows
has a little dialog for changing stuff like that.

Paul

[David]

On 30/12/2024 01:02, Paul wrote:
> On Sun, 12/29/2024 5:28 PM, David wrote:
>
>> I'm downloading PCLOS xfce right now. I'll use balenaEtcher to load the
>> software onto a memory stick. How do I make it operate 'live' on my Dell
>> laptop with the sound problem?
>
> Doing this much, was the hard part.
>
> Why wouldn't it work ?
>
> *******
>
> You need to know how to do popup boot or how to do boot selection.
> It's not nearly as easy on a Dell.
>
> My Dell is rather unique in the room, in that if you plug in two
> USB boot sticks, there is no way to select one of two. To have
> my Dell boot a USB stick, there can only be one USB stick plugged in.
> All the other computers in the room, you just cursor down to the
> USB stick you want, out of N sticks.
>
> The Dell has a quirky BIOS, which means there are a number of tiny issues.
>
> *******
>
> This means that, plugging the stick into some other brand of computer,
> the experience could be a lot more pleasant. I find I have to spend
> a lot more time with Dell people, using my fevered imagination to
> guess at what curve ball Dell has thrown this time. Like various
> beverages, Dell is an acquired taste. Some people get used to the
> Dell abuse (unnecessary edits to the BIOS that Dell has you make),
> other just leave their Dell parked in the corner.
>
> I took my Dell out of RAID Ready mode, because it was driving me nuts.
> What i didn't think about though, is if the BIOS CMOS battery
> dies on me, I have no records of what settings have to be put back :-)
> If the CMOS battery is changed, I'm going to have to do part of whatever
> I did, over again.
>
> Bring back a symptoms description, if it doesn't work. some of the Dell
> sound, is standard stuff, but they also have a tiny amplifier board
> and a piezo in mine, and sound has only come out of that a couple times.
>
> You can use the
>
> inxi -F
>
> command and get a dump of what hardware is in the box. That is
> easier than some other ways of listing the hardware.
>
> On some of my hardware here, the sound is put on the HDMI cable, and
> since none of my display devices have speakers, I would never hear a sound
> sent there by accident. You have to review the output selection,
> to ensure a real speaker is going to get the sound. I have to change
> something from "HDMI sound" to "Analog speaker sound". Even Windows
> has a little dialog for changing stuff like that.

Thanks for your input, Paul.

Is THIS what you were after?

System:
Kernel: 6.8.0-38-generic arch: x86_64 bits: 64 compiler: gcc v: 13.2.0
Desktop: Cinnamon v: 6.2.7 tk: GTK v: 3.24.41 wm: Muffin dm: LightDM
Distro: Linux Mint 22 Wilma base: Ubuntu 24.04 noble
Machine:
Type: Laptop System: Dell product: Inspiron 13-5368 v: N/A serial:
<superuser required> Chassis:
type: 9 serial: <superuser required>
Mobo: Dell model: 0WVDG2 v: A00 serial: <superuser required> part-nu:
073B UEFI-[Legacy]: Dell
v: 1.19.0 date: 12/12/2018
Battery:
ID-1: BAT0 charge: 18.4 Wh (62.8%) condition: 29.3/42.0 Wh (69.8%)
volts: 11.8 min: 11.4
model: Samsung SDI DELL FC92N65 serial: <filter> status: discharging
CPU:
Info: dual core model: Intel Core i3-6100U bits: 64 type: MT MCP
arch: Skylake rev: 3 cache:
L1: 128 KiB L2: 512 KiB L3: 3 MiB
Speed (MHz): avg: 800 min/max: 400/2300 cores: 1: 800 2: 800 3: 800
4: 800 bogomips: 18399
Flags: avx avx2 ht lm nx pae sse sse2 sse3 sse4_1 sse4_2 ssse3 vmx
Graphics:
Device-1: Intel Skylake GT2 [HD Graphics 520] vendor: Dell driver:
i915 v: kernel arch: Gen-9
ports: active: eDP-1 empty: HDMI-A-1 bus-ID: 00:02.0 chip-ID: 8086:1916
Device-2: Sunplus Innovation Integrated Webcam driver: uvcvideo type:
USB rev: 2.0
speed: 480 Mb/s lanes: 1 bus-ID: 1-5:3 chip-ID: 1bcf:2c01
Display: x11 server: X.Org v: 21.1.11 with: Xwayland v: 23.2.6
driver: X: loaded: modesetting
unloaded: fbdev,vesa dri: iris gpu: i915 display-ID: :0 screens: 1
Screen-1: 0 s-res: 1920x1080 s-dpi: 96
Monitor-1: eDP-1 model: AU Optronics 0x102d res: 1920x1080 dpi: 166
diag: 336mm (13.2")
API: EGL v: 1.5 platforms: device: 0 drv: iris device: 1 drv: swrast
gbm: drv: iris
surfaceless: drv: iris x11: drv: iris inactive: wayland
API: OpenGL v: 4.6 compat-v: 4.5 vendor: intel mesa v:
24.0.9-0ubuntu0.1 glx-v: 1.4
direct-render: yes renderer: Mesa Intel HD Graphics 520 (SKL GT2)
device-ID: 8086:1916
Audio:
Device-1: Intel Sunrise Point-LP HD Audio vendor: Dell driver:
snd_hda_intel v: kernel
bus-ID: 00:1f.3 chip-ID: 8086:9d70
API: ALSA v: k6.8.0-38-generic status: kernel-api
Server-1: PipeWire v: 1.0.5 status: active with: 1: pipewire-pulse
status: active
2: wireplumber status: active 3: pipewire-alsa type: plugin
Network:
Device-1: Intel Wireless 3165 driver: iwlwifi v: kernel pcie: speed:
2.5 GT/s lanes: 1
bus-ID: 01:00.0 chip-ID: 8086:3165
IF: wlp1s0 state: up mac: <filter>
Bluetooth:
Device-1: Intel Bluetooth wireless interface driver: btusb v: 0.8
type: USB rev: 2.0
speed: 12 Mb/s lanes: 1 bus-ID: 1-6:4 chip-ID: 8087:0a2a
Report: hciconfig ID: hci0 rfk-id: 0 state: up address: <filter>
bt-v: 4.2 lmp-v: 8 sub-v: 1000
Drives:
Local Storage: total: 473.1 GiB used: 1.7 MiB (0.0%)
ID-1: /dev/sda vendor: Western Digital model: WD5000LPCX-75VHAT0
size: 465.76 GiB
speed: 6.0 Gb/s serial: <filter>
ID-2: /dev/sdb vendor: Lexar model: JumpDrive size: 7.34 GiB type:
USB rev: 2.0 spd: 480 Mb/s
lanes: 1 serial: <filter>
Partition:
ID-1: / size: 1.79 GiB used: 277.4 MiB (15.2%) fs: overlay source:
ERR-102
ID-2: /var/log size: 4.47 GiB used: 1.7 MiB (0.0%) fs: ext4 dev:
/dev/sdb3
Swap:
Alert: No swap data was found.
Sensors:
System Temperatures: cpu: 43.0 C pch: 38.5 C mobo: 38.0 C sodimm:
SODIMM C
Fan Speeds (rpm): cpu: 0
Repos:
Packages: pm: dpkg pkgs: 1994
Active apt repos in: /etc/apt/sources.list
1: deb cdrom:[Linux Mint 22 _Wilma_ - Release amd64 20240721]/
noble contrib main
Active apt repos in:
/etc/apt/sources.list.d/official-package-repositories.list
1: deb http: //packages.linuxmint.com wilma main upstream import
backport
2: deb http: //archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu noble main restricted
universe multiverse
3: deb http: //archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu noble-updates main
restricted universe multiverse
4: deb http: //archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu noble-backports main
restricted universe multiverse
5: deb http: //security.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ noble-security main
restricted universe multiverse
Info:
Memory: total: 4 GiB note: est. available: 3.57 GiB used: 1.73 GiB
(48.5%)
Processes: 232 Power: uptime: 1h 52m wakeups: 0 Init: systemd v: 255
target: graphical (5)
default: graphical
Compilers: gcc: 13.2.0 Client: Unknown python3.12 client inxi: 3.3.34

=

HTH

--
David

[Paul]

On Mon, 12/30/2024 8:36 AM, David wrote:

>
> Thanks for your input, Paul.
>
> Is THIS what you were after?
>
> System:
>   Kernel: 6.8.0-38-generic arch: x86_64 bits: 64 compiler: gcc v: 13.2.0
>   Desktop: Cinnamon v: 6.2.7 tk: GTK v: 3.24.41 wm: Muffin dm: LightDM
>     Distro: Linux Mint 22 Wilma base: Ubuntu 24.04 noble
> Machine:
>   Type: Laptop System: Dell product: Inspiron 13-5368 v: N/A serial: <superuser required> Chassis:
>     type: 9 serial: <superuser required>
>   Mobo: Dell model: 0WVDG2 v: A00 serial: <superuser required> part-nu: 073B UEFI-[Legacy]: Dell
>     v: 1.19.0 date: 12/12/2018
> Battery:
>   ID-1: BAT0 charge: 18.4 Wh (62.8%) condition: 29.3/42.0 Wh (69.8%) volts: 11.8 min: 11.4
>     model: Samsung SDI DELL FC92N65 serial: <filter> status: discharging
> CPU:
>   Info: dual core model: Intel Core i3-6100U bits: 64 type: MT MCP arch: Skylake rev: 3 cache:
>     L1: 128 KiB L2: 512 KiB L3: 3 MiB
>   Speed (MHz): avg: 800 min/max: 400/2300 cores: 1: 800 2: 800 3: 800 4: 800 bogomips: 18399
>   Flags: avx avx2 ht lm nx pae sse sse2 sse3 sse4_1 sse4_2 ssse3 vmx
> Graphics:
>   Device-1: Intel Skylake GT2 [HD Graphics 520] vendor: Dell driver: i915 v: kernel arch: Gen-9
>     ports: active: eDP-1 empty: HDMI-A-1 bus-ID: 00:02.0 chip-ID: 8086:1916
>   Device-2: Sunplus Innovation Integrated Webcam driver: uvcvideo type: USB rev: 2.0
>     speed: 480 Mb/s lanes: 1 bus-ID: 1-5:3 chip-ID: 1bcf:2c01
>   Display: x11 server: X.Org v: 21.1.11 with: Xwayland v: 23.2.6 driver: X: loaded: modesetting
>     unloaded: fbdev,vesa dri: iris gpu: i915 display-ID: :0 screens: 1
>   Screen-1: 0 s-res: 1920x1080 s-dpi: 96
>   Monitor-1: eDP-1 model: AU Optronics 0x102d res: 1920x1080 dpi: 166 diag: 336mm (13.2")
>   API: EGL v: 1.5 platforms: device: 0 drv: iris device: 1 drv: swrast gbm: drv: iris
>     surfaceless: drv: iris x11: drv: iris inactive: wayland
>   API: OpenGL v: 4.6 compat-v: 4.5 vendor: intel mesa v: 24.0.9-0ubuntu0.1 glx-v: 1.4
>     direct-render: yes renderer: Mesa Intel HD Graphics 520 (SKL GT2) device-ID: 8086:1916
> Audio:
>   Device-1: Intel Sunrise Point-LP HD Audio vendor: Dell driver: snd_hda_intel v: kernel
>     bus-ID: 00:1f.3 chip-ID: 8086:9d70
>   API: ALSA v: k6.8.0-38-generic status: kernel-api
>   Server-1: PipeWire v: 1.0.5 status: active with: 1: pipewire-pulse status: active
>     2: wireplumber status: active 3: pipewire-alsa type: plugin
> Network:
>   Device-1: Intel Wireless 3165 driver: iwlwifi v: kernel pcie: speed: 2.5 GT/s lanes: 1
>     bus-ID: 01:00.0 chip-ID: 8086:3165
>   IF: wlp1s0 state: up mac: <filter>
> Bluetooth:
>   Device-1: Intel Bluetooth wireless interface driver: btusb v: 0.8 type: USB rev: 2.0
>     speed: 12 Mb/s lanes: 1 bus-ID: 1-6:4 chip-ID: 8087:0a2a
>   Report: hciconfig ID: hci0 rfk-id: 0 state: up address: <filter> bt-v: 4.2 lmp-v: 8 sub-v: 1000
> Drives:
>   Local Storage: total: 473.1 GiB used: 1.7 MiB (0.0%)
>   ID-1: /dev/sda vendor: Western Digital model: WD5000LPCX-75VHAT0 size: 465.76 GiB
>     speed: 6.0 Gb/s serial: <filter>
>   ID-2: /dev/sdb vendor: Lexar model: JumpDrive size: 7.34 GiB type: USB rev: 2.0 spd: 480 Mb/s
>     lanes: 1 serial: <filter>
> Partition:
>   ID-1: / size: 1.79 GiB used: 277.4 MiB (15.2%) fs: overlay source: ERR-102
>   ID-2: /var/log size: 4.47 GiB used: 1.7 MiB (0.0%) fs: ext4 dev: /dev/sdb3
> Swap:
>   Alert: No swap data was found.
> Sensors:
>   System Temperatures: cpu: 43.0 C pch: 38.5 C mobo: 38.0 C sodimm: SODIMM C
>   Fan Speeds (rpm): cpu: 0
> Repos:
>   Packages: pm: dpkg pkgs: 1994
>   Active apt repos in: /etc/apt/sources.list
>     1: deb cdrom:[Linux Mint 22 _Wilma_ - Release amd64 20240721]/ noble contrib main
>   Active apt repos in: /etc/apt/sources.list.d/official-package-repositories.list
>     1: deb http: //packages.linuxmint.com wilma main upstream import backport
>     2: deb http: //archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu noble main restricted universe multiverse
>     3: deb http: //archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu noble-updates main restricted universe multiverse
>     4: deb http: //archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu noble-backports main restricted universe multiverse
>     5: deb http: //security.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ noble-security main restricted universe multiverse
> Info:
>   Memory: total: 4 GiB note: est. available: 3.57 GiB used: 1.73 GiB (48.5%)
>   Processes: 232 Power: uptime: 1h 52m wakeups: 0 Init: systemd v: 255 target: graphical (5)
>     default: graphical
>   Compilers: gcc: 13.2.0 Client: Unknown python3.12 client inxi: 3.3.34

Yes. Your audio looks pretty ordinary (as HDAudio hardware,
many devices look like that). While your graphics subsystem lists
HDMI, it does not appear your hardware is from the era where sound
went over HDMI (the default transport when that is implemented
is LPCM 7.1 channel, as there is no licensing fee for unencoded audio
such as that standard).

It's possible one of your Apple products has audio over HDMI for example.
It's a more common feature on modern equipment, and the only reason
for mentioning the topic, is it tends to foul up the "output selection"
and do the wrong thing. You want the audio selection dialog to
say "Analog Stereo" or "Analog Line Out" and hot have the word "HDMI"
or "Digital" in it. While some people have elaborate listening rooms,
where signal-on-HDMI is appropriate, it is more common for people
to have cheap analog audio for computer speakers. The audio on this
machine cost $25 (two speakers from the recycler store), and the second
computer has my home-made amp for computer speakers (about two watts
into some book shelf speakers).

I have Fedora on the cooker right now, and to fit it, I blew away
an LM22 that was on that partition :-/ So I can't easily take a picture
of any of this stuff, until I can find my LM22 which is on some
disk around here. I checked the Fedora audio, and as usual, the
selector isn't "Analog Stereo", it is "Digital SPDIF" as my audio panel
on the machine has a red glowing connector, and that's TOSLink output.
And so the software cleverly doesn't select the correct output, it
again has opted for something I don't have (an AV receiver with TOSLink).

You have to find that selector, which is going to be close to the volume
level icon in the interface. Somewhere around there, will be a setup dialog
with the controls to select a different "sink" for the output.

The same goes when you're trying to do a Zoom session, and select an input
for the audio. Some microphones are line level and you plug them into
LineIn. Some are low level and those plug into MicIn. And you have to
check the recording selector, to make sure you have the correct channel
being input to the HDAudio input side.

You can see the poster here, he got a "Dummy Output" for Christmas,
which is like a lump of coal in your stocking. At least there is a picture
of the dlalog you want there.

https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?t=379262

This is more normal on a modern computer, the "pollution" of digital
items that aren't likely to be connected to anything that actually
uses the output. And the person in this thread, is having trouble
with the OS "remembering" the setting for the next time. Like my Fedora
install, this one is using the red-LED TOSLink output for SPDIF audio,
instead of the Analog Output (suited to analog computer speakers, which
is all I've got for speakers).

https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?t=427125

The order of discovery of the items at boot time, can affect
whether the selector can detect them in time to conclude
"the default is available". The person in that thread, is using
a USB audio, and that will be detected at a different time point
than some of the other audios.

Paul

[David]

On 30/12/2024 16:46, Paul wrote:
> On Mon, 12/30/2024 8:36 AM, David wrote:
>
>>
>> Thanks for your input, Paul.
>>
>> Is THIS what you were after?
>>
>> System:
>>   Kernel: 6.8.0-38-generic arch: x86_64 bits: 64 compiler: gcc v: 13.2.0
>>   Desktop: Cinnamon v: 6.2.7 tk: GTK v: 3.24.41 wm: Muffin dm: LightDM
>>     Distro: Linux Mint 22 Wilma base: Ubuntu 24.04 noble
>> Machine:
>>   Type: Laptop System: Dell product: Inspiron 13-5368 v: N/A serial: <superuser required> Chassis:
>>     type: 9 serial: <superuser required>
>>   Mobo: Dell model: 0WVDG2 v: A00 serial: <superuser required> part-nu: 073B UEFI-[Legacy]: Dell
>>     v: 1.19.0 date: 12/12/2018
>> Battery:
>>   ID-1: BAT0 charge: 18.4 Wh (62.8%) condition: 29.3/42.0 Wh (69.8%) volts: 11.8 min: 11.4
>>     model: Samsung SDI DELL FC92N65 serial: <filter> status: discharging
>> CPU:
>>   Info: dual core model: Intel Core i3-6100U bits: 64 type: MT MCP arch: Skylake rev: 3 cache:
>>     L1: 128 KiB L2: 512 KiB L3: 3 MiB
>>   Speed (MHz): avg: 800 min/max: 400/2300 cores: 1: 800 2: 800 3: 800 4: 800 bogomips: 18399
>>   Flags: avx avx2 ht lm nx pae sse sse2 sse3 sse4_1 sse4_2 ssse3 vmx
>> Graphics:
>>   Device-1: Intel Skylake GT2 [HD Graphics 520] vendor: Dell driver: i915 v: kernel arch: Gen-9
>>     ports: active: eDP-1 empty: HDMI-A-1 bus-ID: 00:02.0 chip-ID: 8086:1916
>>   Device-2: Sunplus Innovation Integrated Webcam driver: uvcvideo type: USB rev: 2.0
>>     speed: 480 Mb/s lanes: 1 bus-ID: 1-5:3 chip-ID: 1bcf:2c01
>>   Display: x11 server: X.Org v: 21.1.11 with: Xwayland v: 23.2.6 driver: X: loaded: modesetting
>>     unloaded: fbdev,vesa dri: iris gpu: i915 display-ID: :0 screens: 1
>>   Screen-1: 0 s-res: 1920x1080 s-dpi: 96
>>   Monitor-1: eDP-1 model: AU Optronics 0x102d res: 1920x1080 dpi: 166 diag: 336mm (13.2")
>>   API: EGL v: 1.5 platforms: device: 0 drv: iris device: 1 drv: swrast gbm: drv: iris
>>     surfaceless: drv: iris x11: drv: iris inactive: wayland
>>   API: OpenGL v: 4.6 compat-v: 4.5 vendor: intel mesa v: 24.0.9-0ubuntu0.1 glx-v: 1.4
>>     direct-render: yes renderer: Mesa Intel HD Graphics 520 (SKL GT2) device-ID: 8086:1916
>> Audio:
>>   Device-1: Intel Sunrise Point-LP HD Audio vendor: Dell driver: snd_hda_intel v: kernel
>>     bus-ID: 00:1f.3 chip-ID: 8086:9d70
>>   API: ALSA v: k6.8.0-38-generic status: kernel-api
>>   Server-1: PipeWire v: 1.0.5 status: active with: 1: pipewire-pulse status: active
>>     2: wireplumber status: active 3: pipewire-alsa type: plugin
>> Network:
>>   Device-1: Intel Wireless 3165 driver: iwlwifi v: kernel pcie: speed: 2.5 GT/s lanes: 1
>>     bus-ID: 01:00.0 chip-ID: 8086:3165
>>   IF: wlp1s0 state: up mac: <filter>
>> Bluetooth:
>>   Device-1: Intel Bluetooth wireless interface driver: btusb v: 0.8 type: USB rev: 2.0
>>     speed: 12 Mb/s lanes: 1 bus-ID: 1-6:4 chip-ID: 8087:0a2a
>>   Report: hciconfig ID: hci0 rfk-id: 0 state: up address: <filter> bt-v: 4.2 lmp-v: 8 sub-v: 1000
>> Drives:
>>   Local Storage: total: 473.1 GiB used: 1.7 MiB (0.0%)
>>   ID-1: /dev/sda vendor: Western Digital model: WD5000LPCX-75VHAT0 size: 465.76 GiB
>>     speed: 6.0 Gb/s serial: <filter>
>>   ID-2: /dev/sdb vendor: Lexar model: JumpDrive size: 7.34 GiB type: USB rev: 2.0 spd: 480 Mb/s
>>     lanes: 1 serial: <filter>
>> Partition:
>>   ID-1: / size: 1.79 GiB used: 277.4 MiB (15.2%) fs: overlay source: ERR-102
>>   ID-2: /var/log size: 4.47 GiB used: 1.7 MiB (0.0%) fs: ext4 dev: /dev/sdb3
>> Swap:
>>   Alert: No swap data was found.
>> Sensors:
>>   System Temperatures: cpu: 43.0 C pch: 38.5 C mobo: 38.0 C sodimm: SODIMM C
>>   Fan Speeds (rpm): cpu: 0
>> Repos:
>>   Packages: pm: dpkg pkgs: 1994
>>   Active apt repos in: /etc/apt/sources.list
>>     1: deb cdrom:[Linux Mint 22 _Wilma_ - Release amd64 20240721]/ noble contrib main
>>   Active apt repos in: /etc/apt/sources.list.d/official-package-repositories.list
>>     1: deb http: //packages.linuxmint.com wilma main upstream import backport
>>     2: deb http: //archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu noble main restricted universe multiverse
>>     3: deb http: //archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu noble-updates main restricted universe multiverse
>>     4: deb http: //archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu noble-backports main restricted universe multiverse
>>     5: deb http: //security.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ noble-security main restricted universe multiverse
>> Info:
>>   Memory: total: 4 GiB note: est. available: 3.57 GiB used: 1.73 GiB (48.5%)
>>   Processes: 232 Power: uptime: 1h 52m wakeups: 0 Init: systemd v: 255 target: graphical (5)
>>     default: graphical
>>   Compilers: gcc: 13.2.0 Client: Unknown python3.12 client inxi: 3.3.34
>
> Yes. Your audio looks pretty ordinary (as HDAudio hardware,
> many devices look like that). While your graphics subsystem lists
> HDMI, it does not appear your hardware is from the era where sound
> went over HDMI (the default transport when that is implemented
> is LPCM 7.1 channel, as there is no licensing fee for unencoded audio
> such as that standard).
>
> It's possible one of your Apple products has audio over HDMI for example.
> It's a more common feature on modern equipment, and the only reason
> for mentioning the topic, is it tends to foul up the "output selection"
> and do the wrong thing. You want the audio selection dialog to
> say "Analog Stereo" or "Analog Line Out" and hot have the word "HDMI"
> or "Digital" in it. While some people have elaborate listening rooms,
> where signal-on-HDMI is appropriate, it is more common for people
> to have cheap analog audio for computer speakers. The audio on this
> machine cost $25 (two speakers from the recycler store), and the second
> computer has my home-made amp for computer speakers (about two watts
> into some book shelf speakers).
>
> I have Fedora on the cooker right now, and to fit it, I blew away
> an LM22 that was on that partition :-/ So I can't easily take a picture
> of any of this stuff, until I can find my LM22 which is on some
> disk around here. I checked the Fedora audio, and as usual, the
> selector isn't "Analog Stereo", it is "Digital SPDIF" as my audio panel
> on the machine has a red glowing connector, and that's TOSLink output.
> And so the software cleverly doesn't select the correct output, it
> again has opted for something I don't have (an AV receiver with TOSLink).
>
> You have to find that selector, which is going to be close to the volume
> level icon in the interface. Somewhere around there, will be a setup dialog
> with the controls to select a different "sink" for the output.
>
> The same goes when you're trying to do a Zoom session, and select an input
> for the audio. Some microphones are line level and you plug them into
> LineIn. Some are low level and those plug into MicIn. And you have to
> check the recording selector, to make sure you have the correct channel
> being input to the HDAudio input side.
>
> You can see the poster here, he got a "Dummy Output" for Christmas,
> which is like a lump of coal in your stocking. At least there is a picture
> of the dlalog you want there.
>
> https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?t=379262
>
> This is more normal on a modern computer, the "pollution" of digital
> items that aren't likely to be connected to anything that actually
> uses the output. And the person in this thread, is having trouble
> with the OS "remembering" the setting for the next time. Like my Fedora
> install, this one is using the red-LED TOSLink output for SPDIF audio,
> instead of the Analog Output (suited to analog computer speakers, which
> is all I've got for speakers).
>
> https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?t=427125
>
> The order of discovery of the items at boot time, can affect
> whether the selector can detect them in time to conclude
> "the default is available". The person in that thread, is using
> a USB audio, and that will be detected at a different time point
> than some of the other audios.

Thanks for chatting, Paul.

Here's the thread which *I* started on that forum:-

https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?p=2567954#p2567954

I fear I need more hand-holding as I get older! <sigh>

I'm currently wiping the hard drive again on the Dell laptop and will
look again tomorrow.

--
David
My Apple iMac doesn't pose such problems for me! ;-)

[Paul]

On Mon, 12/30/2024 5:35 PM, David wrote:

>
> Thanks for chatting, Paul.
>
> Here's the thread which *I* started on that forum:-
>
> https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?p=2567954#p2567954
>
> I fear I need more hand-holding as I get older! <sigh>
>
> I'm currently wiping the hard drive again on the Dell laptop and will look again tomorrow.

I tried a test of LM22 on the old E8400 CPU with HD6450 video card and 16GB RAM,
and this is what you see when testing the analog sound. I was using
simplescreenrecorder to record the screen, which is why the CPU usage
is so high. The sound is Intel HDAudio and some small CODEC for the analog.

[Picture]

https://i.postimg.cc/0NnSjVnX/Optiplex-LM22-sound-test.gif

The sound works and comes out of the speakers.

I find LM 21.3 is better for old computers,
and LM 22 just isn't quite the same for the job.

The LM21.3 uses the 5.15 kernel, while LM22 uses 6.x.y kernels.

Paul

[David]

On 31/12/2024 09:16, Paul wrote:
> On Mon, 12/30/2024 5:35 PM, David wrote:
>
>>
>> Thanks for chatting, Paul.
>>
>> Here's the thread which *I* started on that forum:-
>>
>> https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?p=2567954#p2567954
>>
>> I fear I need more hand-holding as I get older! <sigh>
>>
>> I'm currently wiping the hard drive again on the Dell laptop and will look again tomorrow.
>
> I tried a test of LM22 on the old E8400 CPU with HD6450 video card and 16GB RAM,
> and this is what you see when testing the analog sound. I was using
> simplescreenrecorder to record the screen, which is why the CPU usage
> is so high. The sound is Intel HDAudio and some small CODEC for the analog.
>
> [Picture]
>
> https://i.postimg.cc/0NnSjVnX/Optiplex-LM22-sound-test.gif
>
> The sound works and comes out of the speakers.
>
> I find LM 21.3 is better for old computers,
> and LM 22 just isn't quite the same for the job.
>
> The LM21.3 uses the 5.15 kernel, while LM22 uses 6.x.y kernels.

Thanks, Paul.

I've got the same grandfather clock ticking sounds using MX Linux as I
had with Mint, so the only thing I can think of is that perhaps flashing
the BIOS will be necessary to fix the sound failure.

I've read about what to do - but not yet tried to do it!

https://www.dell.com/support/kbdoc/en-uk/000123870/how-to-flash-the-bios-on-a-dell-desktop-or-notebook-with-a-usb-thumb-drive

--
David

[Paul]

On Tue, 12/31/2024 6:46 AM, David wrote:
> On 31/12/2024 09:16, Paul wrote:
>> On Mon, 12/30/2024 5:35 PM, David wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Thanks for chatting, Paul.
>>>
>>> Here's the thread which *I* started on that forum:-
>>>
>>> https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?p=2567954#p2567954
>>>
>>> I fear I need more hand-holding as I get older! <sigh>
>>>
>>> I'm currently wiping the hard drive again on the Dell laptop and will look again tomorrow.
>>
>> I tried a test of LM22 on the old E8400 CPU with HD6450 video card and 16GB RAM,
>> and this is what you see when testing the analog sound. I was using
>> simplescreenrecorder to record the screen, which is why the CPU usage
>> is so high. The sound is Intel HDAudio and some small CODEC for the analog.
>>
>>     [Picture]
>>
>>      https://i.postimg.cc/0NnSjVnX/Optiplex-LM22-sound-test.gif
>>
>> The sound works and comes out of the speakers.
>>
>> I find LM 21.3 is better for old computers,
>> and LM 22 just isn't quite the same for the job.
>>
>> The LM21.3 uses the 5.15 kernel, while LM22 uses 6.x.y kernels.
>
> Thanks, Paul.
>
> I've got the same grandfather clock ticking sounds using MX Linux as I
> had with Mint, so the only thing I can think of is that perhaps flashing
> the BIOS will be necessary to fix the sound failure.
>
> I've read about what to do - but not yet tried to do it!
>
> https://www.dell.com/support/kbdoc/en-uk/000123870/how-to-flash-the-bios-on-a-dell-desktop-or-notebook-with-a-usb-thumb-drive
>

Googling on the first statement may dig up more articles on repair statements.

https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/xzxkef/realtek_alc256_sound_card_issue_fix/

"... /etc/modprobe.d mine is called alsa-base.conf

options snd-intel-dspcfg dsp_driver=1
options snd-hda-intel model=dell-headset-multi
options snd-hda-intel power_save=1
"

*******

I couldn't find a datasheet for ALC256, but it's possible the part
description is "2 channel CODEC with equalizer", where the equalizer
is the driver code, rather than inside the chip itself. To put a
processor inside the ALC256, with a small RAM for temporary variables,
that's just not RealTeks style. Any kind of DSP solution, or even
a mixed analog/digital chip platform, you could put together
a multi-band equalizer (or even a basic bass/treble control).

The problem could be with a "null" driver that removes the DSP
and copies the voice samples from one place to another (with the
wrong sample rate used). Or, it could be the DSP part was
surgically removed properly, but it is an actual
old-fashioned 44100 Hz versus 48000 Hz issue. We used
to have ticking in the past, cause by improper sampling
rate handling.

Paul

[David]

On 01/01/2025 15:10, Paul wrote:
> On Tue, 12/31/2024 6:46 AM, David wrote:
>> On 31/12/2024 09:16, Paul wrote:
>>> On Mon, 12/30/2024 5:35 PM, David wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for chatting, Paul.
>>>>
>>>> Here's the thread which *I* started on that forum:-
>>>>
>>>> https://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?p=2567954#p2567954
>>>>
>>>> I fear I need more hand-holding as I get older! <sigh>
>>>>
>>>> I'm currently wiping the hard drive again on the Dell laptop and will look again tomorrow.
>>>
>>> I tried a test of LM22 on the old E8400 CPU with HD6450 video card and 16GB RAM,
>>> and this is what you see when testing the analog sound. I was using
>>> simplescreenrecorder to record the screen, which is why the CPU usage
>>> is so high. The sound is Intel HDAudio and some small CODEC for the analog.
>>>
>>>     [Picture]
>>>
>>>      https://i.postimg.cc/0NnSjVnX/Optiplex-LM22-sound-test.gif
>>>
>>> The sound works and comes out of the speakers.
>>>
>>> I find LM 21.3 is better for old computers,
>>> and LM 22 just isn't quite the same for the job.
>>>
>>> The LM21.3 uses the 5.15 kernel, while LM22 uses 6.x.y kernels.
>>
>> Thanks, Paul.
>>
>> I've got the same grandfather clock ticking sounds using MX Linux as I
>> had with Mint, so the only thing I can think of is that perhaps flashing
>> the BIOS will be necessary to fix the sound failure.
>>
>> I've read about what to do - but not yet tried to do it!
>>
>> https://www.dell.com/support/kbdoc/en-uk/000123870/how-to-flash-the-bios-on-a-dell-desktop-or-notebook-with-a-usb-thumb-drive
>>
>
> Googling on the first statement may dig up more articles on repair statements.
>
> https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/xzxkef/realtek_alc256_sound_card_issue_fix/
>
> "... /etc/modprobe.d mine is called alsa-base.conf
>
> options snd-intel-dspcfg dsp_driver=1
> options snd-hda-intel model=dell-headset-multi
> options snd-hda-intel power_save=1
> "
>
> *******
>
> I couldn't find a datasheet for ALC256, but it's possible the part
> description is "2 channel CODEC with equalizer", where the equalizer
> is the driver code, rather than inside the chip itself. To put a
> processor inside the ALC256, with a small RAM for temporary variables,
> that's just not RealTeks style. Any kind of DSP solution, or even
> a mixed analog/digital chip platform, you could put together
> a multi-band equalizer (or even a basic bass/treble control).
>
> The problem could be with a "null" driver that removes the DSP
> and copies the voice samples from one place to another (with the
> wrong sample rate used). Or, it could be the DSP part was
> surgically removed properly, but it is an actual
> old-fashioned 44100 Hz versus 48000 Hz issue. We used
> to have ticking in the past, cause by improper sampling
> rate handling.


Hello again, Paul - UPDATE!

All good exercise to keep the grey matter ticking over! I'm just
completing the *full installation* of Ubuntu alongside Windows 10 on my
old Dell laptop. I awarded it 100GB of space on the disk.

It's taking longer than I expected. I'll report back later.

--
David

[David]

On 12/01/2025 23:11, David wrote:
[....]
> Hello again, Paul - UPDATE!
>
> All good exercise to keep the grey matter ticking over! I'm just
> completing the *full installation* of Ubuntu alongside Windows 10 on my
> old Dell laptop. I awarded it 100GB of space on the disk.
>
> It's taking longer than I expected. I'll report back later.

For your interest:-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q5yM4ZYwB_s

I am familiar with Ubuntu. I have it as a dual boot on my ancient Dell
DESKTOP computer which is still running Windows XP (but I rarely fire it
up!)

--
Time for bed, Zebedee!
David

[Paul]

On Sun, 1/12/2025 6:47 PM, David wrote:
> On 12/01/2025 23:11, David wrote:
> [....]
>> Hello again, Paul - UPDATE!
>>
>> All good exercise to keep the grey matter ticking over! I'm just completing the *full installation* of Ubuntu alongside Windows 10 on my old Dell laptop. I awarded it 100GB of space on the disk.
>>
>> It's taking longer than I expected. I'll report back later.
>
> For your interest:-
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q5yM4ZYwB_s
>
> I am familiar with Ubuntu. I have it as a dual boot on my ancient Dell DESKTOP computer which is still running Windows XP (but I rarely fire it up!)
>

It's a 6GB DVD and uses Snaps for installation.

As soon as the install is finished, the Snaps need
to be updated *again*.

Yes, I could see that being a bit slow.

*******

https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/xzxkef/realtek_alc256_sound_card_issue_fix/

"... /etc/modprobe.d mine is called alsa-base.conf

options snd-intel-dspcfg dsp_driver=1
options snd-hda-intel model=dell-headset-multi
options snd-hda-intel power_save=1
"

The implication, is that the detection of this particular sound
solution, might not be as easy as some other setups. That's why
the regular detection needs to be blacklisted, so that the
packages that could make it work, get installed.

I'm not understanding this at all. Each generation of hardware
seems to be using a different driver. sof, sst, what's the deal ?
What is to be gained by Intel, by doing this ? It's a stereo
output on a laptop, isn't working sound worth more than no
sound at all ?

https://github.com/thesofproject/sof/issues/2931

Paul

[rbowman]

On Sun, 12 Jan 2025 19:52:17 -0500, Paul wrote:

> On Sun, 1/12/2025 6:47 PM, David wrote:
>> On 12/01/2025 23:11, David wrote:
>> [....]
>>> Hello again, Paul - UPDATE!
>>>
>>> All good exercise to keep the grey matter ticking over! I'm just
>>> completing the *full installation* of Ubuntu alongside Windows 10 on
>>> my old Dell laptop. I awarded it 100GB of space on the disk.
>>>
>>> It's taking longer than I expected. I'll report back later.
>>
>> For your interest:-
>>
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q5yM4ZYwB_s
>>
>> I am familiar with Ubuntu. I have it as a dual boot on my ancient Dell
>> DESKTOP computer which is still running Windows XP (but I rarely fire
>> it up!)
>>
>>
> It's a 6GB DVD and uses Snaps for installation.
>
> As soon as the install is finished, the Snaps need to be updated
> *again*.
>
> Yes, I could see that being a bit slow.

I upgraded from 22.04 to 24.04 a couple of days ago. There were a couple
of speed bumps that needed manual intervention but it went fairly rapidly.

Until the 'cleanup' phase that is. It spent 25 minutes 'searching for
obsolete software'. WTF?

[Paul]

On Mon, 1/13/2025 1:38 AM, rbowman wrote:
> On Sun, 12 Jan 2025 19:52:17 -0500, Paul wrote:
>
>> On Sun, 1/12/2025 6:47 PM, David wrote:
>>> On 12/01/2025 23:11, David wrote:
>>> [....]
>>>> Hello again, Paul - UPDATE!
>>>>
>>>> All good exercise to keep the grey matter ticking over! I'm just
>>>> completing the *full installation* of Ubuntu alongside Windows 10 on
>>>> my old Dell laptop. I awarded it 100GB of space on the disk.
>>>>
>>>> It's taking longer than I expected. I'll report back later.
>>>
>>> For your interest:-
>>>
>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q5yM4ZYwB_s
>>>
>>> I am familiar with Ubuntu. I have it as a dual boot on my ancient Dell
>>> DESKTOP computer which is still running Windows XP (but I rarely fire
>>> it up!)
>>>
>>>
>> It's a 6GB DVD and uses Snaps for installation.
>>
>> As soon as the install is finished, the Snaps need to be updated
>> *again*.
>>
>> Yes, I could see that being a bit slow.
>
> I upgraded from 22.04 to 24.04 a couple of days ago. There were a couple
> of speed bumps that needed manual intervention but it went fairly rapidly.
>
> Until the 'cleanup' phase that is. It spent 25 minutes 'searching for
> obsolete software'. WTF?

Maybe they hired a Microsoft developer ?

That does seem a bit excessive.

You would have to use "top", to get some idea what
was using cycles at the time. I sometimes watch installs using
a copy of "top", for that sort of reason.

Paul

[Harold Stevens]

In <***@mid.individual.net> David:

[Snip...]

> I am familiar with Ubuntu. I have it as a dual boot on my ancient Dell
> DESKTOP computer which is still running Windows XP (but I rarely fire it
> up!)

I have a similar setup. It's the only Windows I've ever left deliberately on any
gear I own.

The sole reason is to run the Belkin Bulldog battery backup monitor app to setup
the IPv4 addresses on the Belkin A/C powerline internet adapters.

That's my broadband over powerline local LAN (wired ethernet). It's not directly
online under XP (please excuse slrn snit over lines longer tha 80 chars):

https://www.tomshardware.com/software/windows/idle-windows-xp-and-2000-machines-
get-infected-with-viruses-within-minutes-of-being-exposed-online

--
Regards, Weird (Harold Stevens) * IMPORTANT EMAIL INFO FOLLOWS *
Pardon any bogus email addresses (wookie) in place for spambots.
Really, it's (wyrd) at att, dotted with net. * DO NOT SPAM IT. *
I toss GoogleGroup (http://twovoyagers.com/improve-usenet.org/).

[David]

On 13/01/2025 09:52, Harold Stevens wrote:
> In <***@mid.individual.net> David:
>
> [Snip...]
>
>> I am familiar with Ubuntu. I have it as a dual boot on my ancient Dell
>> DESKTOP computer which is still running Windows XP (but I rarely fire it
>> up!)
>
> I have a similar setup. It's the only Windows I've ever left deliberately on any
> gear I own.
>
> The sole reason is to run the Belkin Bulldog battery backup monitor app to setup
> the IPv4 addresses on the Belkin A/C powerline internet adapters.
>
> That's my broadband over powerline local LAN (wired ethernet). It's not directly
> online under XP (please excuse slrn snit over lines longer tha 80 chars):
>
> https://www.tomshardware.com/software/windows/idle-windows-xp-and-2000-machines-
> get-infected-with-viruses-within-minutes-of-being-exposed-online

Thanks for that, Harold!

I remembered that I've also got Windows 10 on the old Lenovo laptop
which I used to use on my narrowboat. I've updated that and was pleased
to find that it still works as well as any Windows machine does!

So, right now I'm loading a Dell OS Recovery Tool onto my 32GB thumb
drive. It should have completed by the time I wake up tomorrow morning.
I'll then see if I can use it to start my Dell laptop (which has no sound).

I'll keep you posted!

--
David

[Mike Easter]

BDB wrote:
> I'll then see if I can use it to start my Dell laptop (which has no sound).

The Dell has sound under MS W10 or Hiren's W11 PE. I would also expect
it to w/ the Dell W10 install.


--
Mike Easter

[David]

On 20/01/2025 23:27, Mike Easter wrote:
> BDB wrote:
>> I'll then see if I can use it to start my Dell laptop (which has no
>> sound).
>
> The Dell has sound under MS W10 or Hiren's W11 PE.  I would also expect
> it to w/ the Dell W10 install.

It's 'Good Morning' from me now, here in the UK! 🙂

I removed my thumb drive from my old Toshiba laptop and inserted it into
a USB port on my old Dell laptop and then simply switched it on.

The Dell started up with a 'Window' on its screen ..... and the the
start up procedure began. Rightly or wrongly, I formatted the drive
completely and Windows 10 is now installing (67%).

More later.

--
David

[Mike Easter]

David wrote:
> The Dell started up with a 'Window' on its screen ..... and the the
> start up procedure began. Rightly or wrongly, I formatted the drive
> completely and Windows 10 is now installing (67%).

I think it is just as well to replace the Ubuntu w/ a Dell W10, mainly
because

- I'm not really a Ub Gnome fan (sorry, a.o.l.u) but an Ub
'offsprings' fan :-)
- altho' you've expressed no interest in a dual boot, I think it would
be a 'good thing'
- for a dual boot, it would be a LOT easier for you to put the linux
on 2nd than 1st

The reason I think a dual Win/linux would be good on that machine is
because:

- you like to keep your systems as updated as possible
- W10's updating days are nearly over, so its EOL as being updated is
nearly done
- modern linuxes updated will be good on that Dell for years to come
- W10 can be useful as a 'secondary' boot on the Dell, which can never
use a 'real' W11, except for the Hiren's PE W11 (or similar)

When your Dell has its W10, hopefully you will have a news agent you are
familiar, such as Tb and you can use it to paste info into a newsgroup
about what sound/audio device/s the device manager shows to help solve
the mystery about its sound on linux.

I can refresh your recollection about how to see the W10 sound devices
AND 'extract' their device chip-IDs in the linux format I'm familiar,
xxxx:yyyy

--
Mike Easter

[David]

On 21/01/2025 16:20, Mike Easter wrote:
> David wrote:
>> The Dell started up with a 'Window' on its screen ..... and the the
>> start up procedure began. Rightly or wrongly, I formatted the drive
>> completely and Windows 10 is now installing (67%).
>
> I think it is just as well to replace the Ubuntu w/ a Dell W10, mainly
> because
>
>  - I'm not really a Ub Gnome fan (sorry, a.o.l.u) but an Ub
> 'offsprings' fan :-)
>  - altho' you've expressed no interest in a dual boot, I think it would
> be a 'good thing'

Don't forget I have dual boot on both my Toyota laptop (W10/Ubuntu) and
on my old Dell Desktop (XP/Ubuntu)!!

>  - for a dual boot, it would be a LOT easier for you to put the linux
> on 2nd than 1st

Agreed.

> The reason I think a dual Win/linux would be good on that machine is
> because:
>
>  - you like to keep your systems as updated as possible
>  - W10's updating days are nearly over, so its EOL as being updated is
> nearly done
>  - modern linuxes updated will be good on that Dell for years to come
>  - W10 can be useful as a 'secondary' boot on the Dell, which can never
> use a 'real' W11, except for the Hiren's PE W11 (or similar)

Agreed.

> When your Dell has its W10, hopefully you will have a news agent you are
> familiar, such as Tb and you can use it to paste info into a newsgroup
> about what sound/audio device/s the device manager shows to help solve
> the mystery about its sound on linux.

I now have Windows 10 - but am still 'updating'.

> I can refresh your recollection about how to see the W10 sound devices
> AND 'extract' their device chip-IDs in the linux format I'm familiar,
> xxxx:yyyy

You are so very kind, Mike. I'd like that ......... I'll advise WHEN if
that's OK.

--
David

[David]

On 21/01/2025 17:13, David is *SO SORRY*!
> my Toyota laptop

AAARGHH!!!

I meant to say TOSHIBA <rolls eyes>!

--
David

[Jeff Layman]

On 21/01/2025 17:16, David wrote:
> On 21/01/2025 17:13, David is *SO SORRY*!
>> my Toyota laptop
>
> AAARGHH!!!
>
> I meant to say TOSHIBA <rolls eyes>!

We knew what you meant...after all it is a "hybrid" laptop. ;-)

--
Jeff

[David]

On 21/01/2025 18:43, Jeff Layman wrote:
> On 21/01/2025 17:16, David wrote:
>> On 21/01/2025 17:13, David is *SO SORRY*!
>>> my Toyota laptop
>>
>> AAARGHH!!!
>>
>> I meant to say TOSHIBA  <rolls eyes>!
>
> We knew what you meant...after all it is a "hybrid" laptop. ;-)

Haha! :-D Thanks, Jeff!

[Mike Easter]

BDB wrote:
> I now have Windows 10 - but am still 'updating'.

I figured that would be a lengthy process, as the Dell's W10 would be
positively ancient.

I suppose it would even be possible (or even likely) for something to
break during all of that updating, in which case it would become
necessary to go back to the MS W10 .iso method.


--
Mike Easter

[David]

On 21/01/2025 17:31, Mike Easter wrote:
> BDB wrote:
>> I now have Windows 10 - but am still 'updating'.
>
> I figured that would be a lengthy process, as the Dell's W10 would be
> positively ancient.
>
> I suppose it would even be possible (or even likely) for something to
> break during all of that updating, in which case it would become
> necessary to go back to the MS W10 .iso method.

You may be pleased to learn that I am now on the latest version of
Windows 10!

22H2 General Availability Channel 2022-10-18 2025-01-14 19045.5371
2025-10-14

My BIOS setting is now 1.23.1

I still have no sound.

What would you like me to try now?

--
David

[Mike Easter]

BDB wrote:
> You may be pleased to learn that I am now on the latest version of
> Windows 10!
>
> 22H2     General Availability Channel     2022-10-18     2025-01-14
> 19045.5371 2025-10-14
>
> My BIOS setting is now 1.23.1
>
> I still have no sound.
>
> What would you like me to try now?

My recollection is that you had sound w/ both the MS W10 and the Hiren's
W11 PE.

I would recommend that you boot the live W11 PE that you have. At one
time you had a current Ventoy stick. All you would have to do would be
to copy the Hiren's .iso to that Ventoy and boot it. Then we would have
sound via Win implementation.

If you have 'destroyed' your Ventoy stick and you have also forgotten
how to make it w/ linux browser GUI, say so and maybe we can figure out
a simple route to see the device manager of a Win w/ working speakers.


--
Mike Easter

[David]

On 23/01/2025 22:14, Mike Easter wrote:
> BDB wrote:
>> You may be pleased to learn that I am now on the latest version of
>> Windows 10!

On my Dell laptop Service Tag - 4WX4YB2

>> 22H2     General Availability Channel     2022-10-18     2025-01-14
>> 19045.5371 2025-10-14
>>
>> My BIOS setting is now 1.23.1
>>
>> *I still have no sound*.
>>
>> What would you like me to try now?
>
> My recollection is that you had sound w/ both the MS W10 and the Hiren's
> W11 PE.
>
> I would recommend that you boot the live W11 PE that you have.  At one
> time you had a current Ventoy stick.  All you would have to do would be
> to copy the Hiren's .iso to that Ventoy and boot it.  Then we would have
> sound via Win implementation.

I've gone past that stage!

> If you have 'destroyed' your Ventoy stick and you have also forgotten
> how to make it w/ linux browser GUI, say so and maybe we can figure out
> a simple route to see the device manager of a Win w/ working speakers.

Your memory is slipping! This Dell laptop has /never/ had any sound as
far as I can recall.

I thought you'd wanted to use the CLI to find information for you to
consider.

(Windows 10 Usenet group added.)

--
David

[David]

On 23/01/2025 22:43, David wrote:
> On 23/01/2025 22:14, Mike Easter wrote:
>> BDB wrote:
>>> You may be pleased to learn that I am now on the latest version of
>>> Windows 10!
>
> On my Dell laptop Service Tag - 4WX4YB2
>
>>> 22H2     General Availability Channel     2022-10-18     2025-01-14
>>> 19045.5371 2025-10-14
>>>
>>> My BIOS setting is now 1.23.1
>>>
>>> *I still have no sound*.
>>>
>>> What would you like me to try now?
>>
>> My recollection is that you had sound w/ both the MS W10 and the
>> Hiren's W11 PE.
>>
>> I would recommend that you boot the live W11 PE that you have.  At one
>> time you had a current Ventoy stick.  All you would have to do would
>> be to copy the Hiren's .iso to that Ventoy and boot it.  Then we would
>> have sound via Win implementation.
>
> I've gone past that stage!
>
>> If you have 'destroyed' your Ventoy stick and you have also forgotten
>> how to make it w/ linux browser GUI, say so and maybe we can figure
>> out a simple route to see the device manager of a Win w/ working
>> speakers.
>
> Your memory is slipping! This Dell laptop has /never/ had any sound as
> far as I can recall.
>
> I thought you'd wanted to use the CLI to find information for you to
> consider.
>
> (Windows 10 Usenet group added.)

Reposted

[Mike Easter]

David wrote:
> David wrote:
>> Mike Easter wrote:
>>> BDB wrote:
>>>> You may be pleased to learn that I am now on the latest version of
>>>> Windows 10!
>>
>> On my Dell laptop Service Tag - 4WX4YB2
>>
>>>> 22H2     General Availability Channel     2022-10-18     2025-01-14
>>>> 19045.5371 2025-10-14
>>>>
>>>> My BIOS setting is now 1.23.1
>>>>
>>>> *I still have no sound*.
>>>>
>>>> What would you like me to try now?
>>>
>>> My recollection is that you had sound w/ both the MS W10 and the
>>> Hiren's W11 PE.
>>>
>>> I would recommend that you boot the live W11 PE that you have.  At
>>> one time you had a current Ventoy stick.  All you would have to do
>>> would be to copy the Hiren's .iso to that Ventoy and boot it.  Then
>>> we would have sound via Win implementation.
>>
>> I've gone past that stage!
>>
>>> If you have 'destroyed' your Ventoy stick and you have also forgotten
>>> how to make it w/ linux browser GUI, say so and maybe we can figure
>>> out a simple route to see the device manager of a Win w/ working
>>> speakers.
>>
>> Your memory is slipping! This Dell laptop has /never/ had any sound as
>> far as I can recall.
>>
My recollection and confirmation by this HK message:

http://al.howardknight.net/?ID=173767883500
From: David
Newsgroups: alt.os.linux.mint
Subject: Re: Ping: Paul
Date: Tue, 7 Jan 2025 20:43:20 +0000
Message-ID: <***@mid.individual.net>

You said that while running Hiren's W11 PE that you used its sound test
function which says such as Right speaker and Left speaker (as I recall)
that you heard sound from both (each individually) speakers:

> Thanks. I've done that - I hear a sound from both left and right speakers.

I haven't put my fingers on the msg in which you stated that you also
had appropriate sound from the W10 install which was done from a MS W10 .iso

Not just a click as heard on various linux installs and live boots.

--
Mike Easter

[Paul]

On Thu, 1/23/2025 5:48 PM, David wrote:
> On 23/01/2025 22:43, David wrote:
>> On 23/01/2025 22:14, Mike Easter wrote:
>>> BDB wrote:
>>>> You may be pleased to learn that I am now on the latest version of Windows 10!
>>
>> On my Dell laptop Service Tag - 4WX4YB2
>>
>>>> 22H2     General Availability Channel     2022-10-18     2025-01-14 19045.5371 2025-10-14
>>>>
>>>> My BIOS setting is now 1.23.1
>>>>
>>>> *I still have no sound*.
>>>>
>>>> What would you like me to try now?
>>>
>>> My recollection is that you had sound w/ both the MS W10 and the Hiren's W11 PE.
>>>
>>> I would recommend that you boot the live W11 PE that you have.  At one time you had a current Ventoy stick.  All you would have to do would be to copy the Hiren's .iso to that Ventoy and boot it.  Then we would have sound via Win implementation.
>>
>> I've gone past that stage!
>>
>>> If you have 'destroyed' your Ventoy stick and you have also forgotten how to make it w/ linux browser GUI, say so and maybe we can figure out a simple route to see the device manager of a Win w/ working speakers.
>>
>> Your memory is slipping! This Dell laptop has /never/ had any sound as far as I can recall.
>>
>> I thought you'd wanted to use the CLI to find information for you to consider.
>>
>> (Windows 10 Usenet group added.)
>
> Reposted
>

You have the Windows driver. But Windows has ways of rejecting those,
so I don't know if a current Windows 10 will accept that driver
in the normal way.

Name: Realtek-High-Definition-Audio-Driver_D7VCY_WIN_6.0.1.8224_A08_02.EXE
Size: 318,464,720 bytes (303 MiB)
SHA256: 04A92B91607ECE504A72A5E9C22DC65A1BC2170B7D887EA980FBAF22D237D585

On the Linux side, it is suggested to do the following if the
driver is blacklisted and some other driver was tried in its place.

You can quickfix this with a "sudo modprobe snd_hda_intel"
and a "sudo alsactl force-reload' but you still need to
remove the blacklisted module in /etc/modprobe.d (which file varies) –
osirisgothra
Commented Aug 13, 2023 at 21:15

In addition, apparently some of the behaviors are related to Linux power saving.
These would only be of interest, if the previous paragraph was resolved successfully.

sudo tee /etc/modprobe.d/snd-hda-intel.conf <<<'options snd-hda-intel power_save=0' # headphones

sudo hda-verb /dev/snd/hwC0D0 0x02 SET_POWER 0x0 # speakers

Equipment ID:

Realtek ALC3253 on Dell Inspiron 13" 5368 (Speaker Amp Type unknown -- could be 2W analog, not 5W digital)
Dell Inspiron 13-5368 2-In-1 (P69G001)

Paul

[David]

On 24/01/2025 07:40, Paul wrote:
> On Thu, 1/23/2025 5:48 PM, David wrote:
>> On 23/01/2025 22:43, David wrote:
>>> On 23/01/2025 22:14, Mike Easter wrote:
>>>> BDB wrote:
>>>>> You may be pleased to learn that I am now on the latest version of Windows 10!
>>>
>>> On my Dell laptop Service Tag - 4WX4YB2
>>>
>>>>> 22H2     General Availability Channel     2022-10-18     2025-01-14 19045.5371 2025-10-14
>>>>>
>>>>> My BIOS setting is now 1.23.1
>>>>>
>>>>> *I still have no sound*.
>>>>>
>>>>> What would you like me to try now?
>>>>
>>>> My recollection is that you had sound w/ both the MS W10 and the Hiren's W11 PE.
>>>>
>>>> I would recommend that you boot the live W11 PE that you have.  At one time you had a current Ventoy stick.  All you would have to do would be to copy the Hiren's .iso to that Ventoy and boot it.  Then we would have sound via Win implementation.
>>>
>>> I've gone past that stage!
>>>
>>>> If you have 'destroyed' your Ventoy stick and you have also forgotten how to make it w/ linux browser GUI, say so and maybe we can figure out a simple route to see the device manager of a Win w/ working speakers.
>>>
>>> Your memory is slipping! This Dell laptop has /never/ had any sound as far as I can recall.
>>>
>>> I thought you'd wanted to use the CLI to find information for you to consider.
>>>
>>> (Windows 10 Usenet group added.)
>>
>> Reposted
>>
>
> You have the Windows driver. But Windows has ways of rejecting those,
> so I don't know if a current Windows 10 will accept that driver
> in the normal way.
>
> Name: Realtek-High-Definition-Audio-Driver_D7VCY_WIN_6.0.1.8224_A08_02.EXE
> Size: 318,464,720 bytes (303 MiB)
> SHA256: 04A92B91607ECE504A72A5E9C22DC65A1BC2170B7D887EA980FBAF22D237D585
>
> On the Linux side, it is suggested to do the following if the
> driver is blacklisted and some other driver was tried in its place.
>
> You can quickfix this with a "sudo modprobe snd_hda_intel"
> and a "sudo alsactl force-reload' but you still need to
> remove the blacklisted module in /etc/modprobe.d (which file varies) –
> osirisgothra
> Commented Aug 13, 2023 at 21:15
>
> In addition, apparently some of the behaviors are related to Linux power saving.
> These would only be of interest, if the previous paragraph was resolved successfully.
>
> sudo tee /etc/modprobe.d/snd-hda-intel.conf <<<'options snd-hda-intel power_save=0' # headphones
>
> sudo hda-verb /dev/snd/hwC0D0 0x02 SET_POWER 0x0 # speakers
>
> Equipment ID:
>
> Realtek ALC3253 on Dell Inspiron 13" 5368 (Speaker Amp Type unknown -- could be 2W analog, not 5W digital)
> Dell Inspiron 13-5368 2-In-1 (P69G001)



All very interesting, Paul, BUT .....

What, exactly, do you recommend that I physically *DO*, now, to
determine if it is possible to play music or hear speech on this device?

Thanks.

--
David

[Mike Easter]

BDB wrote:
> What, exactly, do you recommend that I physically *DO*, now, to
> determine if it is possible to play music or hear speech on this device?

Will you confirm or deny that both Hiren's W11 PE and the install of the
MS W10 .iso were successful in playing sound? That has been my
impression since Jan 7.

Since then, my next intention was to use the information from the Win
device manager to provide information in an Win environment w/ working
audio from the case speakers to interpret in the manner I'm accustomed
to doing in linux from the chip ID number in the format xxxx:yyyy.

I was able to use that type information in the W10 Lenovo laptop I have
which has two audio devices, which worked properly in Win, the HDMI one
of which did NOT play in linux until I remedied the problem with a boot
parameter when booting linux.

This story has been very broken by your struggles w/ providing a
consistent picture with a consistent setup in a consistent thread in a
consistent newsgroup.


--
Mike Easter

[David]

On 24/01/2025 17:09, Mike Easter wrote:
> BDB wrote:
>> What, exactly, do you recommend that I physically *DO*, now, to
>> determine if it is possible to play music or hear speech on this device?
>
> Will you confirm or deny that both Hiren's W11 PE and the install of the
> MS W10 .iso were successful in playing sound?  That has been my
> impression since Jan 7.

At no time have I ever heard music or speech from the laptop speakers.

I HAVE heard a 'click' sound - indicating (to me) that each speaker (L &
R) can receive a signal.

> Since then, my next intention was to use the information from the Win
> device manager to provide information in an Win environment w/ working
> audio from the case speakers to interpret in the manner I'm accustomed
> to doing in linux from the chip ID number in the format xxxx:yyyy.

My Device Manager shows 1. Intel(R) Display Audio and 2. Realtek Audio

> I was able to use that type information in the W10 Lenovo laptop I have
> which has two audio devices, which worked properly in Win, the HDMI one
> of which did NOT play in linux until I remedied the problem with a boot
> parameter when booting linux.

I'm aware that you are a Linux buff.

> This story has been very broken by your struggles w/ providing a
> consistent picture with a consistent setup in a consistent thread in a
> consistent newsgroup.

You are correct, as usual.

[%]

David wrote:
> On 24/01/2025 17:09, Mike Easter wrote:
>> BDB wrote:
>>> What, exactly, do you recommend that I physically *DO*, now, to
>>> determine if it is possible to play music or hear speech on this device?
>>
>> Will you confirm or deny that both Hiren's W11 PE and the install of
>> the MS W10 .iso were successful in playing sound?  That has been my
>> impression since Jan 7.
>
> At no time have I ever heard music or speech from the laptop speakers.
>
> I HAVE heard a 'click' sound - indicating (to me) that each speaker (L &
> R) can receive a signal.
>
>> Since then, my next intention was to use the information from the Win
>> device manager to provide information in an Win environment w/ working
>> audio from the case speakers to interpret in the manner I'm accustomed
>> to doing in linux from the chip ID number in the format xxxx:yyyy.
>
> My Device Manager shows 1. Intel(R) Display Audio and 2. Realtek Audio
>
>> I was able to use that type information in the W10 Lenovo laptop I
>> have which has two audio devices, which worked properly in Win, the
>> HDMI one of which did NOT play in linux until I remedied the problem
>> with a boot parameter when booting linux.
>
> I'm aware that you are a Linux buff.
>
>> This story has been very broken by your struggles w/ providing a
>> consistent picture with a consistent setup in a consistent thread in a
>> consistent newsgroup.
>
> You are correct, as usual.
>
mine plays frank zappa guitar leads when it's not even on

[Mike Easter]

David wrote:
> At no time have I ever heard music or speech from the laptop speakers.

On the basis of my experience w/ my Lenovo laptop which also had HDMI
case speakers which did not play w/ linux until I boot parameter
'radeon-ized' it, at which time linux did play thru' the case speakers...

... but at /all/ times, both default Win (which played thru' the case)
and default linux (which did NOT play thru' the case) but DID play thru'
the headset...

... the 'gain' of functional case speakers, in terms of sound quality,
wasn't worth the trouble.

For a very long time, I did not even /know/ the case speakers didn't
work on that device because of how I use it and do NOT normally listen
to sound on it. Once I started listening to sound in the process of
troubleshooting what worked and what did not work, I discovered that...

... the case speakers aren't *WORTH* listening to. Even the world's
cheapest ear phones sound was superior to that of the case speakers.

My advice to you regarding this particular device, considering your
other device options:

- forget about getting the sound to come from those case speakers
- if you are going to listen to sound, listen via the headset plug
only or not at all


--
Mike Easter

[Paul]

On Fri, 1/24/2025 3:55 AM, David wrote:
> On 24/01/2025 07:40, Paul wrote:
>> On Thu, 1/23/2025 5:48 PM, David wrote:
>>> On 23/01/2025 22:43, David wrote:
>>>> On 23/01/2025 22:14, Mike Easter wrote:
>>>>> BDB wrote:
>>>>>> You may be pleased to learn that I am now on the latest version of Windows 10!
>>>>
>>>> On my Dell laptop Service Tag - 4WX4YB2
>>>>
>>>>>> 22H2     General Availability Channel     2022-10-18     2025-01-14 19045.5371 2025-10-14
>>>>>>
>>>>>> My BIOS setting is now 1.23.1
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *I still have no sound*.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> What would you like me to try now?
>>>>>
>>>>> My recollection is that you had sound w/ both the MS W10 and the Hiren's W11 PE.
>>>>>
>>>>> I would recommend that you boot the live W11 PE that you have.  At one time you had a current Ventoy stick.  All you would have to do would be to copy the Hiren's .iso to that Ventoy and boot it.  Then we would have sound via Win implementation.
>>>>
>>>> I've gone past that stage!
>>>>
>>>>> If you have 'destroyed' your Ventoy stick and you have also forgotten how to make it w/ linux browser GUI, say so and maybe we can figure out a simple route to see the device manager of a Win w/ working speakers.
>>>>
>>>> Your memory is slipping! This Dell laptop has /never/ had any sound as far as I can recall.
>>>>
>>>> I thought you'd wanted to use the CLI to find information for you to consider.
>>>>
>>>> (Windows 10 Usenet group added.)
>>>
>>> Reposted
>>>
>>
>> You have the Windows driver. But Windows has ways of rejecting those,
>> so I don't know if a current Windows 10 will accept that driver
>> in the normal way.
>>
>>     Name: Realtek-High-Definition-Audio-Driver_D7VCY_WIN_6.0.1.8224_A08_02.EXE
>>     Size: 318,464,720 bytes (303 MiB)
>>     SHA256: 04A92B91607ECE504A72A5E9C22DC65A1BC2170B7D887EA980FBAF22D237D585
>>
>> On the Linux side, it is suggested to do the following if the
>> driver is blacklisted and some other driver was tried in its place.
>>
>>     You can quickfix this with a "sudo modprobe snd_hda_intel"
>>     and a "sudo alsactl force-reload' but you still need to
>>     remove the blacklisted module in /etc/modprobe.d (which file varies) –
>>     osirisgothra
>>     Commented Aug 13, 2023 at 21:15
>>
>> In addition, apparently some of the behaviors are related to Linux power saving.
>> These would only be of interest, if the previous paragraph was resolved successfully.
>>
>>     sudo tee /etc/modprobe.d/snd-hda-intel.conf <<<'options snd-hda-intel power_save=0'     # headphones
>>
>>     sudo hda-verb /dev/snd/hwC0D0 0x02 SET_POWER 0x0                                        # speakers
>>
>> Equipment ID:
>>
>>     Realtek ALC3253 on Dell Inspiron 13" 5368        (Speaker Amp Type unknown -- could be 2W analog, not 5W digital)
>>     Dell Inspiron 13-5368 2-In-1 (P69G001)
>
>
>
> All very interesting, Paul, BUT .....
>
> What, exactly, do you recommend that I physically *DO*, now, to
> determine if it is possible to play music or hear speech on this device?
>
> Thanks.
>

On Windows 10, you can check Device Manager (right-click start, it should be in there).
But that's a bit of a bore.

Look for the speaker icon in the task bar.

Apparently, all outputs can be listed, but only
the devices which are currently hooked up and
ready to use, can be set as "Default Device".

If two devices are both ready (like my HDMI monitor
and my analog speakers), then I have two devices I
can alternate between.

*******

The difference on Linux Mint, is on the video card,
only the output which is running can be used for
an output. In the picture, only one of four video
card outputs is connected at present, so only
one LCD-monitor-related outputs can have sound on it.

On a laptop, when just the (lvds) LCDpanel is being used,
there is no reason for any iGPU entry to be present
in the sound output selection.

The Realtek outputs are all listed, but the speakers
are plugged into LineOut at the moment. While Analog
Devices Soundmax has actual impedance measurement, and
some motherboards have side-contect HDAudio jacks to detect
that a plug is present, some motherboards do not know
that a plug is inserted. The RealTek does not typically
have impedance measurement capability (protected by a patent).

[Picture]

https://i.postimg.cc/dt02vvv6/speaker-selection.gif

Paul

[David]

On 24/01/2025 19:45, Paul wrote:
> On Fri, 1/24/2025 3:55 AM, David wrote:
>> On 24/01/2025 07:40, Paul wrote:
>>> On Thu, 1/23/2025 5:48 PM, David wrote:
>>>> On 23/01/2025 22:43, David wrote:
>>>>> On 23/01/2025 22:14, Mike Easter wrote:
>>>>>> BDB wrote:
>>>>>>> You may be pleased to learn that I am now on the latest version of Windows 10!
>>>>>
>>>>> On my Dell laptop Service Tag - 4WX4YB2
>>>>>
>>>>>>> 22H2     General Availability Channel     2022-10-18     2025-01-14 19045.5371 2025-10-14
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> My BIOS setting is now 1.23.1
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *I still have no sound*.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> What would you like me to try now?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> My recollection is that you had sound w/ both the MS W10 and the Hiren's W11 PE.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I would recommend that you boot the live W11 PE that you have.  At one time you had a current Ventoy stick.  All you would have to do would be to copy the Hiren's .iso to that Ventoy and boot it.  Then we would have sound via Win implementation.
>>>>>
>>>>> I've gone past that stage!
>>>>>
>>>>>> If you have 'destroyed' your Ventoy stick and you have also forgotten how to make it w/ linux browser GUI, say so and maybe we can figure out a simple route to see the device manager of a Win w/ working speakers.
>>>>>
>>>>> Your memory is slipping! This Dell laptop has /never/ had any sound as far as I can recall.
>>>>>
>>>>> I thought you'd wanted to use the CLI to find information for you to consider.
>>>>>
>>>>> (Windows 10 Usenet group added.)
>>>>
>>>> Reposted
>>>>
>>>
>>> You have the Windows driver. But Windows has ways of rejecting those,
>>> so I don't know if a current Windows 10 will accept that driver
>>> in the normal way.
>>>
>>>     Name: Realtek-High-Definition-Audio-Driver_D7VCY_WIN_6.0.1.8224_A08_02.EXE
>>>     Size: 318,464,720 bytes (303 MiB)
>>>     SHA256: 04A92B91607ECE504A72A5E9C22DC65A1BC2170B7D887EA980FBAF22D237D585
>>>
>>> On the Linux side, it is suggested to do the following if the
>>> driver is blacklisted and some other driver was tried in its place.
>>>
>>>     You can quickfix this with a "sudo modprobe snd_hda_intel"
>>>     and a "sudo alsactl force-reload' but you still need to
>>>     remove the blacklisted module in /etc/modprobe.d (which file varies) –
>>>     osirisgothra
>>>     Commented Aug 13, 2023 at 21:15
>>>
>>> In addition, apparently some of the behaviors are related to Linux power saving.
>>> These would only be of interest, if the previous paragraph was resolved successfully.
>>>
>>>     sudo tee /etc/modprobe.d/snd-hda-intel.conf <<<'options snd-hda-intel power_save=0'     # headphones
>>>
>>>     sudo hda-verb /dev/snd/hwC0D0 0x02 SET_POWER 0x0                                        # speakers
>>>
>>> Equipment ID:
>>>
>>>     Realtek ALC3253 on Dell Inspiron 13" 5368        (Speaker Amp Type unknown -- could be 2W analog, not 5W digital)
>>>     Dell Inspiron 13-5368 2-In-1 (P69G001)
>>
>>
>>
>> All very interesting, Paul, BUT .....
>>
>> What, exactly, do you recommend that I physically *DO*, now, to
>> determine if it is possible to play music or hear speech on this device?
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>
> On Windows 10, you can check Device Manager (right-click start, it should be in there).
> But that's a bit of a bore.
>
> Look for the speaker icon in the task bar.
>
> Apparently, all outputs can be listed, but only
> the devices which are currently hooked up and
> ready to use, can be set as "Default Device".
>
> If two devices are both ready (like my HDMI monitor
> and my analog speakers), then I have two devices I
> can alternate between.
>
> *******
>
> The difference on Linux Mint, is on the video card,
> only the output which is running can be used for
> an output. In the picture, only one of four video
> card outputs is connected at present, so only
> one LCD-monitor-related outputs can have sound on it.
>
> On a laptop, when just the (lvds) LCDpanel is being used,
> there is no reason for any iGPU entry to be present
> in the sound output selection.
>
> The Realtek outputs are all listed, but the speakers
> are plugged into LineOut at the moment. While Analog
> Devices Soundmax has actual impedance measurement, and
> some motherboards have side-contect HDAudio jacks to detect
> that a plug is present, some motherboards do not know
> that a plug is inserted. The RealTek does not typically
> have impedance measurement capability (protected by a patent).
>
> [Picture]
>
> https://i.postimg.cc/dt02vvv6/speaker-selection.gif
>
> Paul


Hi Paul

I followed the guidance from "David" on Microsoft Answers and made a new
bootable flash drive then once again installed Windows 10 on my old Dell
laptop. Sadly, still no sound!

On the Dell website, though, this time, I was able to carry out a
hardware scan. Here's a screenshot of the failures indicated:-
https://i.ibb.co/XjYDWtv/IMG-3158.jpg

Any comment beyond time to recycle it?!!

--
David

[Mike Easter]

David wrote:
> On the Dell website, though, this time, I was able to carry out a
> hardware scan. Here's a screenshot of the failures indicated:-
> https://i.ibb.co/XjYDWtv/IMG-3158.jpg
>
> Any comment beyond time to recycle it?!!

The screenshot doesn't like the PCI bus situation.

In my world, if something is working, it is working, aside from the
possibility of something NOT working or not working right, whether or
not it is practical to 'fix'.

To me, except for the case speaker sound, the laptop is working. To me,
personally, I would rather be running a linux on it than W10; or perhaps
I would rather be running a dual boot W10 and a modern/current linux
whose end of update life isn't near.

I would keep the W10 install, add a linux distro of your choice install
as an alternate boot trying not to mess up your W10 install again.
Personally, I don't need the sound except occasionally; on the occasion
which I needed sound, I would use the headset plug for Win or linux.

This is cross-posted excessively. Just because some topic of your
interest may deserve posting in some choice of groups doesn't mean that
it should be posted to all of the groups that it possibly pertains.



--
Mike Easter

[Java Jive]

On 2025-01-23 22:48, David wrote:
>
> On 23/01/2025 22:43, David wrote:
>>
>> Your memory is slipping! This Dell laptop has /never/ had any sound as
>> far as I can recall.

I haven't been following this thread at all, and not all of it seems to
be available anyway, so it's possible that someone else might have
suggested this already, but Dells sometimes have function <Fn> key
combinations that control the sound. On this one in front of me, a
Precision M6300, they're as follows ...
<Fn+End> Mute/Unmute sound
<Fn+PageUp> Increase Volume
<Fn+PageDown> Decrease Volume
... while other Dells here have other such <Fn> key combinations marked
but none appear to be for sound. If you haven't already done so,
examine the keyboard for any <Fn> markings that look relevant, usually
they're loud-speaker-like markings in a non-white colour such as orange
or blue.

Also, it may be worth trying to find a manual for it to see if there are
any 'magic' key combinations documented for it.

Also, if you plug some headphones or an amplifier into the headphone
socket, do get sound then? If so, most probably someone has previously
dismantled the PC to fix something or other, and forgotten to reconnect
the internal speakers when re-assembling it.

--

Fake news kills!

I may be contacted via the contact address given on my website:
www.macfh.co.uk

[David]

On 06/02/2025 23:31, Java Jive wrote:
> On 2025-01-23 22:48, David wrote:
>>
>> On 23/01/2025 22:43, David wrote:
>>>
>>> Your memory is slipping! This Dell laptop has /never/ had any sound
>>> as far as I can recall.
>
> I haven't been following this thread at all, and not all of it seems to
> be available anyway, so it's possible that someone else might have
> suggested this already, but Dells sometimes have function <Fn> key
> combinations that control the sound.  On this one in front of me, a
> Precision M6300, they're as follows ...
>     <Fn+End>       Mute/Unmute sound
>     <Fn+PageUp>    Increase Volume
>     <Fn+PageDown>  Decrease Volume
> ... while other Dells here have other such <Fn> key combinations marked
> but none appear to be for sound.  If you haven't already done so,
> examine the keyboard for any <Fn> markings that look relevant, usually
> they're loud-speaker-like markings in a non-white colour such as orange
> or blue.
>
> Also, it may be worth trying to find a manual for it to see if there are
> any 'magic' key combinations documented for it.
>
> Also, if you plug some headphones or an amplifier into the headphone
> socket, do get sound then?  If so, most probably someone has previously
> dismantled the PC to fix something or other, and forgotten to reconnect
> the internal speakers when re-assembling it.

Hello Charles 🙂

How kind of you to step in to try to help. *Thank you*!

You may like to review the situation from beginning to end, here:-

https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/all/how-can-i-regain-sound-from-the-speakers-on-my/6a7dfbdf-98e7-4be7-b9e0-ca878c633132?page=1

Should you have time on your hands nowadays, do come to MY Usenet group
and raise the posting standard somewhat! (alt.computer.workshop)

--
Warm regards,
David

[Java Jive]

On 2025-02-07 16:03, David wrote:
> On 06/02/2025 23:31, Java Jive wrote:
>> On 2025-01-23 22:48, David wrote:
>>>
>>> On 23/01/2025 22:43, David wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Your memory is slipping! This Dell laptop has /never/ had any sound
>>>> as far as I can recall.
>>
>> I haven't been following this thread at all, and not all of it seems
>> to be available anyway, so it's possible that someone else might have
>> suggested this already, but Dells sometimes have function <Fn> key
>> combinations that control the sound.  On this one in front of me, a
>> Precision M6300, they're as follows ...
>>      <Fn+End>       Mute/Unmute sound
>>      <Fn+PageUp>    Increase Volume
>>      <Fn+PageDown>  Decrease Volume
>> ... while other Dells here have other such <Fn> key combinations
>> marked but none appear to be for sound.  If you haven't already done
>> so, examine the keyboard for any <Fn> markings that look relevant,
>> usually they're loud-speaker-like markings in a non-white colour such
>> as orange or blue.
>>
>> Also, it may be worth trying to find a manual for it to see if there
>> are any 'magic' key combinations documented for it.
>>
>> Also, if you plug some headphones or an amplifier into the headphone
>> socket, do get sound then?  If so, most probably someone has
>> previously dismantled the PC to fix something or other, and forgotten
>> to reconnect the internal speakers when re-assembling it.
>
> Hello Charles 🙂
>
> How kind of you to step in to try to help. *Thank you*!
>
> You may like to review the situation from beginning to end, here:-
>
> https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/all/how-can-i-regain-sound-from-the-speakers-on-my/6a7dfbdf-98e7-4be7-b9e0-ca878c633132?page=1

If absolutely no OS, Windows or Linux, can get any sound at all, that
seems like a hardware problem.

--

Fake news kills!

I may be contacted via the contact address given on my website:
www.macfh.co.uk

[Java Jive]

On 2025-02-07 17:04, Java Jive wrote:
>
> If absolutely no OS, Windows or Linux, can get any sound at all, that
> seems like a hardware problem.

One last chance, what happens when you run the Dell Diagnostics?
Formerly these were runnable from a CD, whence you could copy them to a
bootable USB, nowadays usually available via a boot option similar to
<F2> taking you into the BIOS - I'm not sure what actual key it would
be, but you should be able to find out from the Dell site, especially as
you have the laptop's service tag.

If you get no sound via the Diagnostics, then the sound is dead. I have
an Inspiron model here, but it's a different model and Dells are
horribly confusing in that radically different hardware can share the
same model line name, so it wouldn't really be worth my while suggesting
anything based on this one, and I'm not familiar with yours at all.

What I'm getting around to suggesting is that you obtain a service
manual for the laptop and try to find out where the audio hardware is
located. If it's on the mainboard then you'd have to swap the mainboard
to fix it, probably not worth while, but if it's on a daughterboard,
then that may be worth the effort.

A lot will also depend on how easy it is to dismantle the laptop to
repair, because the same brand names can vary a lot. Of the ones I have
here, the Inspiron is the worst of all, but I mainly have Precisions,
and, of those, the M6300s are nearly but not quite as bad as the
Inspiron, whereas with the M6700s and M6800s you just remove the bottom
plage, two screws, and maybe the keyboard, a few more, and almost
everything is accessible, a huge improvement on previous models.

So, if you're minded to investigate further, try the Dell Diagnostics
first, and if you can't hear any sound there, try to obtain a service
manual to get a sense of how difficult or easy (chance would be a fine
thing) it might be to repair with a used part from eBay.

NB: With Dells, the 'service' manuals are often called something that
sounds more like a manual instructing use rather than dismantling or
repair, for example, my Inspiron's Service Manual is simply called the
"Owner's Manual". You'll have to download everything you can and open
each up to find which one is what you want.

--

Fake news kills!

I may be contacted via the contact address given on my website:
www.macfh.co.uk

[Java Jive]

On 2025-02-07 17:39, Java Jive wrote:
>
> remove the bottom plage

... or even 'plate' ...

--

Fake news kills!

I may be contacted via the contact address given on my website:
www.macfh.co.uk

[David]

On 07/02/2025 17:53, Java Jive wrote:
> On 2025-02-07 17:39, Java Jive wrote:
>>
>> remove the bottom plage
>
> ... or even 'plate' ...

👍

[David]

On 07/02/2025 17:39, Java Jive wrote:
> On 2025-02-07 17:04, Java Jive wrote:
>>
>> If absolutely no OS, Windows or Linux, can get any sound at all, that
>> seems like a hardware problem.
>
> One last chance, what happens when you run the Dell Diagnostics?
> Formerly these were runnable from a CD, whence you could copy them to a
> bootable USB, nowadays usually available via a boot option similar to
> <F2> taking you into the BIOS  -  I'm not sure what actual key it would
> be, but you should be able to find out from the Dell site, especially as
> you have the laptop's service tag.
>
> If you get no sound via the Diagnostics, then the sound is dead.  I have
> an Inspiron model here, but it's a different model and Dells are
> horribly confusing in that radically different hardware can share the
> same model line name, so it wouldn't really be worth my while suggesting
> anything based on this one, and I'm not familiar with yours at all.
>
> What I'm getting around to suggesting is that you obtain a service
> manual for the laptop and try to find out where the audio hardware is
> located.  If it's on the mainboard then you'd have to swap the mainboard
> to fix it, probably not worth while, but if it's on a daughterboard,
> then that may be worth the effort.
>
> A lot will also depend on how easy it is to dismantle the laptop to
> repair, because the same brand names can vary a lot.  Of the ones I have
> here, the Inspiron is the worst of all, but I mainly have Precisions,
> and, of those, the M6300s are nearly but not quite as bad as the
> Inspiron, whereas with the M6700s and M6800s you just remove the bottom
> plage, two screws, and maybe the keyboard, a few more, and almost
> everything is accessible, a huge improvement on previous models.
>
> So, if you're minded to investigate further, try the Dell Diagnostics
> first, and if you can't hear any sound there, try to obtain a service
> manual to get a sense of how difficult or easy (chance would be a fine
> thing) it might be to repair with a used part from eBay.
>
> NB:  With Dells, the 'service' manuals are often called something that
> sounds more like a manual instructing use rather than dismantling or
> repair, for example, my Inspiron's Service Manual is simply called the
> "Owner's Manual".  You'll have to download everything you can and open
> each up to find which one is what you want.

"In the old days" I surely would have tried, but it isn't worth the
effort when my grandson has already replaced it with an Apple MacBook
Air and I've got more computers than I can shake a stick at!

It's been nice to meet you, Charles! Come to ACW!

--
David

[Java Jive]

On 2025-02-07 20:03, David wrote:
> On 07/02/2025 17:39, Java Jive wrote:
>> On 2025-02-07 17:04, Java Jive wrote:
>>>
>>> If absolutely no OS, Windows or Linux, can get any sound at all, that
>>> seems like a hardware problem.
>>
>> One last chance, what happens when you run the Dell Diagnostics?
>> Formerly these were runnable from a CD, whence you could copy them to
>> a bootable USB, nowadays usually available via a boot option similar
>> to <F2> taking you into the BIOS  -  I'm not sure what actual key it
>> would be, but you should be able to find out from the Dell site,
>> especially as you have the laptop's service tag.
> > "In the old days" I surely would have tried, but it isn't worth the
> effort when my grandson has already replaced it with an Apple MacBook
> Air and I've got more computers than I can shake a stick at!

I can understand readily enough that you may not be bothered enough to
dismantle an old laptop to repair it, especially if it turns out to be
one of the ones that's a PITA to dismantle and reassemble, but there's
no reason not to run the Dell Diagnostics. That should be pretty easy
to do.

--

Fake news kills!

I may be contacted via the contact address given on my website:
www.macfh.co.uk

[David]

On 07/02/2025 22:03, Java Jive wrote:
> On 2025-02-07 20:03, David wrote:
>> On 07/02/2025 17:39, Java Jive wrote:
>>> On 2025-02-07 17:04, Java Jive wrote:
>>>>
>>>> If absolutely no OS, Windows or Linux, can get any sound at all,
>>>> that seems like a hardware problem.
>>>
>>> One last chance, what happens when you run the Dell Diagnostics?
>>> Formerly these were runnable from a CD, whence you could copy them to
>>> a bootable USB, nowadays usually available via a boot option similar
>>> to <F2> taking you into the BIOS  -  I'm not sure what actual key it
>>> would be, but you should be able to find out from the Dell site,
>>> especially as you have the laptop's service tag.
> > > "In the old days" I surely would have tried, but it isn't worth the
>> effort when my grandson has already replaced it with an Apple MacBook
>> Air and I've got more computers than I can shake a stick at!
>
> I can understand readily enough that you may not be bothered enough to
> dismantle an old laptop to repair it, especially if it turns out to be
> one of the ones that's a PITA to dismantle and reassemble, but there's
> no reason not to run the Dell Diagnostics.  That should be pretty easy
> to do.

I thank you for prodding me into action, but I have already run all the
tests I could find at Dell.

Here's one result:- https://i.ibb.co/kgqwBLbG/IMG-3158.jpg

--
Kind regards,
David
(Devon)

[Java Jive]

On 2025-02-07 23:04, David wrote:
>
> I thank you for prodding me into action, but I have already run all the
> tests I could find at Dell.
>
> Here's one result:- https://i.ibb.co/kgqwBLbG/IMG-3158.jpg

So why did you waste our collective time with this thread???!!!

Plonk!

--

Fake news kills!

I may be contacted via the contact address given on my website:
www.macfh.co.uk

[Paul]

On Fri, 2/7/2025 8:16 PM, Java Jive wrote:
> On 2025-02-07 23:04, David wrote:
>>
>> I thank you for prodding me into action, but I have already run all the tests I could find at Dell.
>>
>> Here's one result:- https://i.ibb.co/kgqwBLbG/IMG-3158.jpg
>
> So why did you waste our collective time with this thread???!!!
>
> Plonk!
>

But that's just the history of diagnostic tests.

What I see in that picture, is the "typical result
of a coder not caring about their work".

One thing to check, is whether the diagnostic is running
as Administrator. Perhaps it is failing because it lacks
access to hardware registers.

There might be expectations about what kind of runtime
environment should be provided. Does it run from WinPE ?
Does it run from Safe Mode ? Are they using something
entirely different (not even Linux) for the test ?

The only diagnostic test that has ever impressed me,
was the diagnostic tests on a Sparc, in response to
flipping the switch to Test on the faceplate. When
that thing told you something was busted, it was
really busted.

I've purchased a couple diagnostics
a long time ago (for desktop computers), which looked
like "busy work" for some dev, and no clear picture that
they were intent on testing anything.

Any time a diagnostic test purports to test something
on the "critical path" for hardware, that path was
tested purely by the ability to be able to POST and boot
the computer. If you find such test items in a test list,
that tells you what percentage bullshit is in the test
suite.

Summary: Be suspicious of diagnostics. Use your head and
analyze what they propose to test. It's pretty easy
to spot the "busy work" versions where they threw
in test cases that have no business being there.

Also, be suspicious of tests which technically cannot
be safely conducted. The SMBUS has no industry-wide
accepted semaphore, to protect usage. Only one program can use
the SMBUS at a time. If two programs try to use it, and
a bus transfer is interrupted (and corrupted), that will
invalidate the results. To safely carry out such a test,
you need sufficient control of the runtime environment,
so that no second program can make accesses while the
"diagnostic" runs. Other buses, like LPC, don't have that
characteristic.

Sound should be test-able, as it is off to the side.
The HDAudio bus, you could likely give that a whack, without
side effects (this assumes there isn't a dialup networking
chip as a second item on the bus). You would still need a
runtime environment that is not doing register-level access
to some HDAudio codec chip.

Part of my job as a hardware guy, was writing enough
tests to prove hardware worked. My programming efforts
are a fly-speck compared to this stuff, but I've had to
think about the isolation aspects, and preventing system
activity from invalidating a test. Seeing as my hardware
was brand-new, there was usually no driver competing with
me for control. I could write my own interrupt handler
if I wanted.

Paul

[David]

On 08/02/2025 01:16, Java Jive wrote:
> On 2025-02-07 23:04, David wrote:
>>
>> I thank you for prodding me into action, but I have already run all
>> the tests I could find at Dell.
>>
>> Here's one result:- https://i.ibb.co/kgqwBLbG/IMG-3158.jpg
>
> So why did you waste our collective time with this thread???!!!
>
> Plonk!

I'd thought you were a decent bloke, not a plonker!

Sad. :-(

[Frank Slootweg]

Java Jive <***@evij.com.invalid> wrote:
> On 2025-02-07 23:04, David wrote:
> >
> > I thank you for prodding me into action, but I have already run all the
> > tests I could find at Dell.
> >
> > Here's one result:- https://i.ibb.co/kgqwBLbG/IMG-3158.jpg
>
> So why did you waste our collective time with this thread???!!!
>
> Plonk!

I think his attempts to drag you/us to alt.computer.workshop are
telling us that he's trolling. Is this by any chance the infamous
"boater Dave"?

And why does he call you "Charles"?

[Char Jackson]

On 8 Feb 2025 15:22:45 GMT, Frank Slootweg <***@ddress.is.invalid>
wrote:

>Java Jive <***@evij.com.invalid> wrote:
>> On 2025-02-07 23:04, David wrote:
>> >
>> > I thank you for prodding me into action, but I have already run all the
>> > tests I could find at Dell.
>> >
>> > Here's one result:- https://i.ibb.co/kgqwBLbG/IMG-3158.jpg
>>
>> So why did you waste our collective time with this thread???!!!
>>
>> Plonk!
>
> I think his attempts to drag you/us to alt.computer.workshop are
>telling us that he's trolling.

Bingo! In other circles, David is very well known for trying to get
people mobilized while he sits back and contributes nothing. He gets a
kick out of it.

>Is this by any chance the infamous "boater Dave"?

The same, unfortunately.

> And why does he call you "Charles"?

Sadly, I could write a book to answer that question.

[Frank Slootweg]

Java Jive <***@evij.com.invalid> wrote:
> On 2025-02-07 16:03, David wrote:
[...]

> If absolutely no OS, Windows or Linux, can get any sound at all, that
> seems like a hardware problem.

I don't know about the OP's computer, but IIRC my UEFI has a
diagnostic for sound, so that can be used to try to rule out any OS
issues.

The OP's computer is apparently a Dell, but it might have something
similar to HP's 'Support Assistant' which has a 'Fix audio issues'
troubleshooter.

And, don't know about Windows 10, but Windows 11 has an 'Audio'
troubleshooter (Settings -> System -> Troubleshoot -> Other
trouble-shooters). A little akward to use, but maybe it does the trick.

[Paul]

On Fri, 2/7/2025 1:42 PM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
> Java Jive <***@evij.com.invalid> wrote:
>> On 2025-02-07 16:03, David wrote:
> [...]
>
>> If absolutely no OS, Windows or Linux, can get any sound at all, that
>> seems like a hardware problem.
>
> I don't know about the OP's computer, but IIRC my UEFI has a
> diagnostic for sound, so that can be used to try to rule out any OS
> issues.
>
> The OP's computer is apparently a Dell, but it might have something
> similar to HP's 'Support Assistant' which has a 'Fix audio issues'
> troubleshooter.
>
> And, don't know about Windows 10, but Windows 11 has an 'Audio'
> troubleshooter (Settings -> System -> Troubleshoot -> Other
> trouble-shooters). A little akward to use, but maybe it does the trick.
>

Part of the troubleshooting, could profit from the use of headphones.

That removes the two laptop speakers (Itchy and Scratchy) from the equation.

Paul

[David]

On 07/02/2025 19:18, Paul wrote:
> On Fri, 2/7/2025 1:42 PM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
>> Java Jive <***@evij.com.invalid> wrote:
>>> On 2025-02-07 16:03, David wrote:
>> [...]
>>
>>> If absolutely no OS, Windows or Linux, can get any sound at all, that
>>> seems like a hardware problem.
>>
>> I don't know about the OP's computer, but IIRC my UEFI has a
>> diagnostic for sound, so that can be used to try to rule out any OS
>> issues.
>>
>> The OP's computer is apparently a Dell, but it might have something
>> similar to HP's 'Support Assistant' which has a 'Fix audio issues'
>> troubleshooter.
>>
>> And, don't know about Windows 10, but Windows 11 has an 'Audio'
>> troubleshooter (Settings -> System -> Troubleshoot -> Other
>> trouble-shooters). A little akward to use, but maybe it does the trick.
>>
>
> Part of the troubleshooting, could profit from the use of headphones.
>
> That removes the two laptop speakers (Itchy and Scratchy) from the equation.
>
> Paul

I did post (somewhere!) that I found some iPhone wired ear-buds which
are surely much the same as headphones, but heard no sound from them
using the Dell's headphone jack.

They DID work, though, when I used them in the USB Plug-In device:-
(7J Channel Sound) https://www.ebay.co.uk/b/bn_6364124

[Paul]

On Fri, 2/7/2025 2:52 PM, David wrote:
> On 07/02/2025 19:18, Paul wrote:
>> On Fri, 2/7/2025 1:42 PM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
>>> Java Jive <***@evij.com.invalid> wrote:
>>>> On 2025-02-07 16:03, David wrote:
>>> [...]
>>>
>>>> If absolutely no OS, Windows or Linux, can get any sound at all, that
>>>> seems like a hardware problem.
>>>
>>>    I don't know about the OP's computer, but IIRC my UEFI has a
>>> diagnostic for sound, so that can be used to try to rule out any OS
>>> issues.
>>>
>>>    The OP's computer is apparently a Dell, but it might have something
>>> similar to HP's 'Support Assistant' which has a 'Fix audio issues'
>>> troubleshooter.
>>>
>>>    And, don't know about Windows 10, but Windows 11 has an 'Audio'
>>> troubleshooter (Settings -> System -> Troubleshoot -> Other
>>> trouble-shooters). A little akward to use, but maybe it does the trick.
>>>
>>
>> Part of the troubleshooting, could profit from the use of headphones.
>>
>> That removes the two laptop speakers (Itchy and Scratchy) from the equation.
>>
>>     Paul
>
> I did post (somewhere!) that I found some iPhone wired ear-buds which
> are surely much the same as headphones, but heard no sound from them using the Dell's headphone jack.
>
> They DID work, though, when I used them in the USB Plug-In device:-
> (7J Channel Sound) https://www.ebay.co.uk/b/bn_6364124

Then the sound just isn't working.

You've proved your headphones work, and when plugged
in, the headphones don't detect anything. They should be
32 ohm headphones, and a match for an HDAudio headphone
widget output.

And you're using the OEM MaxxAudio driver, and I don't know
what else would be more appropriate than that driver.

Check for a speaker shaped icon, in the tray. If the
RealTek is installed, there should be a Speaker icon.
The speaker is sort of on a 45 degree angle, so it's partially
an "angular view of a speaker" icon. That could be the
RealTek icon.

When you click the Speaker Icon (if it is visible of course),
make sure your headphones are plugged in. The control panel
only goes to full-sized dialog, if headphones are in usage.
(The control panel needs to see at least one jack is being
used, to open up to full size.)

Paul

[David]

On 07/02/2025 21:31, Paul wrote:
> On Fri, 2/7/2025 2:52 PM, David wrote:
>> On 07/02/2025 19:18, Paul wrote:
>>> On Fri, 2/7/2025 1:42 PM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
>>>> Java Jive <***@evij.com.invalid> wrote:
>>>>> On 2025-02-07 16:03, David wrote:
>>>> [...]
>>>>
>>>>> If absolutely no OS, Windows or Linux, can get any sound at all, that
>>>>> seems like a hardware problem.
>>>>
>>>>    I don't know about the OP's computer, but IIRC my UEFI has a
>>>> diagnostic for sound, so that can be used to try to rule out any OS
>>>> issues.
>>>>
>>>>    The OP's computer is apparently a Dell, but it might have something
>>>> similar to HP's 'Support Assistant' which has a 'Fix audio issues'
>>>> troubleshooter.
>>>>
>>>>    And, don't know about Windows 10, but Windows 11 has an 'Audio'
>>>> troubleshooter (Settings -> System -> Troubleshoot -> Other
>>>> trouble-shooters). A little akward to use, but maybe it does the trick.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Part of the troubleshooting, could profit from the use of headphones.
>>>
>>> That removes the two laptop speakers (Itchy and Scratchy) from the equation.
>>>
>>>     Paul
>>
>> I did post (somewhere!) that I found some iPhone wired ear-buds which
>> are surely much the same as headphones, but heard no sound from them using the Dell's headphone jack.
>>
>> They DID work, though, when I used them in the USB Plug-In device:-
>> (7J Channel Sound) https://www.ebay.co.uk/b/bn_6364124
>
> Then the sound just isn't working.
>
> You've proved your headphones work, and when plugged
> in, the headphones don't detect anything. They should be
> 32 ohm headphones, and a match for an HDAudio headphone
> widget output.
>
> And you're using the OEM MaxxAudio driver, and I don't know
> what else would be more appropriate than that driver.
>
> Check for a speaker shaped icon, in the tray. If the
> RealTek is installed, there should be a Speaker icon.
> The speaker is sort of on a 45 degree angle, so it's partially
> an "angular view of a speaker" icon. That could be the
> RealTek icon.
>
> When you click the Speaker Icon (if it is visible of course),
> make sure your headphones are plugged in. The control panel
> only goes to full-sized dialog, if headphones are in usage.
> (The control panel needs to see at least one jack is being
> used, to open up to full size.)
>
> Paul

Everything works just as you describe, Paul!

However - TODAY - I *CAN* hear proper music sounds through the ear-buds
which are plugged directly into the laptop 3.5mm headset socket!

This device has gremlins!

--
David

[Mike Easter]

Paul wrote:
> While your graphics subsystem lists
> HDMI, it does not appear your hardware is from the era where sound
> went over HDMI (the default transport when that is implemented
> is LPCM 7.1 channel, as there is no licensing fee for unencoded audio
> such as that standard).

I'm reading an Inspiron 13 5000 series 2in1 manual (from Sears of all
things) which says that its HDMI port can do audio

> HDMI port
> Connect a TV or another HDMI-in enabled device. Provides video and
> audio output.

http://i.sears.com/s/d/pdf/mp-tc/10000001/prod_ec_2048694702

So his accessing his LM 22 audio settings to be sure that somehow a
wrong device mode might have been auto-selected hasn't happened is
necessary. Apparently he is currently working on checking out a W10
install.

--
Mike Easter

[David]

On 31/12/2024 00:35, Mike Easter wrote:
> Apparently he is currently working on checking out a W10 install.

Sadly, that didn't work! balenaEtcher warned me not to use it for
Windows (but I used it anyway - 'cause it was late and I was tired!)

I currently have a Live Linux MX up-and-running on the Dell laptop.

It is producing exactly the same grandfather-clock ticking sound as I
got using Mint!!!

--
David

[Paul]

On Tue, 12/31/2024 6:34 AM, David wrote:
> On 31/12/2024 00:35, Mike Easter wrote:
>> Apparently he is currently working on checking out a W10 install.
>
> Sadly, that didn't work!  balenaEtcher warned me not to use it for Windows (but I used it anyway - 'cause it was late and I was tired!)
>
> I currently have a Live Linux MX up-and-running on the Dell laptop.
>
> It is producing exactly the same grandfather-clock ticking sound as I got using Mint!!!
>

rebranded Realtek ALC 3246 (ALC256)

Have a look at this. It's got some technical content in it.
Apparently something is using firmware.

https://askubuntu.com/questions/1372326/maybe-a-solution-of-sound-problem-on-acer-swift-3-realtek-alc256

And that could be why the chip is rebranded.
By using firmware, the device features can be changed.

Paul

[Mike Easter]

BDB wrote:
> Mike Easter wrote:
>> Apparently he is currently working on checking out a W10 install.
>
> Sadly, that didn't work! balenaEtcher warned me not to use it for
> Windows (but I used it anyway - 'cause it was late and I was tired!)
>
Balena's site explains the Win problem and provides workarounds:

> Etcher copies images to drives byte by byte, without doing any
> transformation to the final device, which means images that require
> special treatment to be made bootable, like Windows images, will not
> work out of the box.

Etcher also mentions other tools which include Rufus described in my
other msg.

But, if you are trying to do this on a Mac, you can't use rufus.




--
Mike Easter

[Paul]

On Tue, 12/31/2024 2:35 PM, Mike Easter wrote:
> BDB wrote:
>> Mike Easter wrote:
>>> Apparently he is currently working on checking out a W10 install.
>>
>> Sadly, that didn't work!  balenaEtcher warned me not to use it for Windows (but I used it anyway - 'cause it was late and I was tired!)
>>
> Balena's site explains the Win problem and provides workarounds:
>
>> Etcher copies images to drives byte by byte, without doing any
>> transformation to the final device, which means images that require
>> special treatment to be made bootable, like Windows images, will not
>> work out of the box.
>
> Etcher also mentions other tools which include Rufus described in my other msg.
>
> But, if you are trying to do this on a Mac, you can't use rufus.

Some days, you need to be a level 39 wizard, stand on the top of a mountain,
and throw lightning bolts :-) Jeez. What a mess of answers.

https://askubuntu.com/questions/289559/how-can-i-create-a-windows-bootable-usb-stick-using-ubuntu

I tried to "dd" one, and that didn't work.

Either burn to a DVD (inconvenient or not possible!) or use Ventoy.

A Win10 x86 (32-bit) DVD is guaranteed to fit on a single-layer DVD,
but the 64-bit ones are most likely to need a dual-layer blank
(which not a lot of people stock as a standard item). I got a short
stack of those, the last time I was at the computer store, and
their entire stock of DVDs, fits under the cash register stand.
Not many left...

That's about it really. This is based on the notion of "shortest path".

a lot of the recipes will leave you spinning in circles.
Like my "dd" attempt. I got a line of "binary" garbage and
then the BIOS moved on. It would not boot off it, and it looked
for all the world, like only legacy boot was supported. Windows
installer DVDs (when you burn a DVD), those are hybrid and
there are two entries in the popup boot in that case.

Microsoft does not particularly care to make their DVDs "convenient".
When the x64 version goes over 4.700 E9 bytes, then the media
doesn't fit on single layer DVD. And you need dual layer. You
would also need dual-layer DVD for a Ubuntu this week. In addition,
the install.wim (or esd.wim) on a Windows DVD, it can go over 4GB
and then a FAT32 container on the USB stick won't work. Some other
install media, the designer uses multiple squashfs files, so that
even a FAT32 for containment works.

I would think, learning how to use Ventoy would be best, taking
care to finish loading up with an LM22 image and a Windows image,
before destroying something and coincidentally ending up with no
boot media.

And for your computer room, I heartily recommend the DVD drive in
USB enclosure. Available as a slim, or as a regular size. I have
one (and I think I have a spare IDE DVD to stuff in the enclosure
if the current one dies). I got the IDE DVD at the surplus center,
I held my breath and asked the guy "you got some of this ancient
technology" and he never tells you how many he's got, he just
answers with Yes, and you can't even look at his stock which
is hidden upstairs. He comes down with your item and there you are.
His "stock" was obtained from a bankrupt radio station and their
<cough> IT department. Which means at most, there were 30 IDE DVD drives
upstairs.

In an emergency, I can pull the DVD drive out of the Mac G4 and
boot off that :-) That's why we keep old computers, for the parts.

Paul

[Mike Easter]

David wrote:
>
> I'm downloading PCLOS xfce right now. I'll use balenaEtcher to load the
> software onto a memory stick. How do I make it operate 'live' on my Dell
> laptop with the sound problem?

You said earlier that you were able to get LM 22 to boot from the USB
live; if that required pressing a function key, you should do that the
same way; then PCLOS gives you an option called live CD.

--
Mike Easter

[David]

On 30/12/2024 02:04, Mike Easter wrote:
> David wrote:
>>
>> I'm downloading PCLOS xfce right now. I'll use balenaEtcher to load
>> the software onto a memory stick. How do I make it operate 'live' on
>> my Dell
>> laptop with the sound problem?
>
> You said earlier that you were able to get LM 22 to boot from the USB
> live; if that required pressing a function key, you should do that the
> same way; then PCLOS gives you an option called live CD.

Thanks, Mike.

I got there - but it didn't actually 'work'! :-(

Abandoned trying and am back with Mint 22.

--
David

[Paul]

On Sun, 12/8/2024 2:59 PM, pinnerite wrote:
> It looks like the snd_hda_intel driver is not present on my machine and
> So far I cannot find a way of installing it.
>
> Should I try a different distro?
>

You could tell us the motherboard make and model again.

The fine manual, doesn't always give the part number for each
mobo chip. The enthusiast site reviews, usually eyeball the chips
and read the numbers off some of them.

If you look in the lower left corner, and see a chip with a "crab"
symbol on it and it is a 48 pin quad flat pack, the number on the
top of that, like "ALC850" tells you what the audio is. But it's Intel
audio because the HDAudio high speed serial bus for it, is off the
Intel PCH.

On HDAudio, the front Left and Front Right have relatively standard
register definitions. This is why, on the Windows side, you could
use a "universal donor" driver, to get enough audio for system sounds.

But we'll know more when we get the make and model number of the mobo.

Sound over HDMI on the video card, can interfere at the "selector level",
and selecting "analog audio" or the like, can fix that. If there is
a "digital... " entry selected currently, that's your problem.
I've had that happen multiple times. It's second nature for the
NVidia sound to make off with my analog speakers.

Paul